Kooks Shorty Header with Hight Flow Cats

[jbradsh1]

Just got off the phone with the Kooks sales rep and he told me that they now have available the stock replacement Kooks header (shorty) with their high flow cats. He did mention that this system hooked up to the stock exhaust would make less of a horsepower increase than the long tube design. I'm considering this option though for a number of reasons, such as quieter, be more certain to maintain the factory warranty, eliminates what seems to be the main bottleneck with the stock exhaust system, i.e., the factory cats. I wanted everyone to know about them and opinions welcome of course!

[Chewy]

From what has been proven on the G8 by another person, the shorties are a waste of money unless you are going for weight reduction. Can you use their cats on the stock manifolds? THAT would be the best IMO if you don't want long tubes now.

I must say that you are very indecisive... lol :cd:

[jbradsh1]

Not so much indecisive but more I know from experience that I like to get as much information as is possible so when I do make a decision, it's a good one. Also, since the G8 GT is a new car this year, there are still other options likely to come on line in the very near future. I'm not in a rush you might say. And I'm not afraid to make a move I just want to be sure when I do that's it's the right one for me. Also I'm just getting into cars after being into fast bikes all my life so I'm definitely a novice when it comes to cars.

[jbradsh1]

And I agree that the one example of shorties, jdp or something, wasn't worth the time but I don't believe that shorty header came with high flow cats, which from what I have gathered, is the main bottleneck in the stock system, is it not?

[Chewy]

Not so much indecisive but more I know from experience that I like to get as much information as is possible so when I do make a decision, it's a good one. Also, since the G8 GT is a new car this year, there are still other options likely to come on line in the very near future. I'm not in a rush you might say. And I'm not afraid to make a move I just want to be sure when I do that's it's the right one for me. Also I'm just getting into cars after being into fast bikes all my life so I'm definitely a novice when it comes to cars.

Yeah I still have two bikes myself! :zing:
What did you have?

[G8Smitty]

The JBA shorties use the stock cats which is what I heard is the real restriction. If that is true the the Kooks shorties should show an improvement.

I can't wait to hear the Dyno numbers!

[jbradsh1]

Lastly, the price of the Kooks shorty headers + high flow cats was $865 according to the Kooks saleman which is a significant difference compared to the full system (over $1700)

[jbradsh1]

Well, I have had H-2's back in the early 70's (chambered with air cleaners + carb mods, etc.) all the way up to my last bike which was a Kawasaki ZX-11 (quite a while ago). With many, many bikes in between.

[Chewy]

And I agree that the one example of shorties, jdp or something, wasn't worth the time but I don't believe that shorty header came with high flow cats, which from what I have gathered, is the main bottleneck in the stock system, is it not?

Yeah but if the headers didn't do anything with the stock cats then I believe the cats with the manifolds would be better than new cats and shorties but that's just me. I guess I have had Soooo many issues with headers (may have been cheap ones) leaking at the heads that I want NOTHING to do with them on my DD. I just know the more you muck with something the more you have chances of screwing the pooch.

I would love to know if those cats fit the stock manifolds. I would do that.

H-2's were widow makers!

[jbradsh1]

G8 Smitty; I asked him that question and he said no dyno runs that he knew about. Seems a little strange, I mean you would at least want to design a system that didn't make less horsepower, if that's possible. But I agree with you that it should show an improvement and I too would like to see a dyno run.

[jbradsh1]

4 Gasem; I sure know what you mean and that is really the main reason I'm q&a'ing with a header replacement system. I do know that MagnFlow will have their high flow cats that do fit the stock header and bolt up with the rest of the stock system in about 2-3 weeks, according to the guy I talked to at MagnaFlow.

[Chewy]

4 Gasem; I sure know what you mean and that is really the main reason I'm q&a'ing with a header replacement system. I do know that MagnFlow will have their high flow cats that do fit the stock header and bolt up with the rest of the stock system in about 2-3 weeks, according to the guy I talked to at MagnaFlow.

Ahh... Good to know! I see they had a part number! I will go with theirs then.

Hope it's not more than expected for them though.:o

[jbradsh1]

4Gasem; yea, H-2 were widow makers if you didn't have a golden angle sitting off your shoulder. God did they high speed wobble half way leaned over. You could fix it a little but compared to newer bikes they were a joke in the handling dept. Never ever got beat on the street though back then, by anything that had wheels on it.

[jbradsh1]

4Gasem; I'm inclined to go the same way. Just get high flow cats. We'll see what develops.

[Mike P]

Just got off the phone with the Kooks sales rep and he told me that they now have available the stock replacement Kooks header (shorty) with their high flow cats. He did mention that this system hooked up to the stock exhaust would make less of a horsepower increase than the long tube design. I'm considering this option though for a number of reasons, such as quieter, be more certain to maintain the factory warranty, eliminates what seems to be the main bottleneck with the stock exhaust system, i.e., the factory cats. I wanted everyone to know about them and opinions welcome of course!


If you are going to get headers & don't want a ton of sound definitely get either Kooks or American Racing Long Tubes, High Flow cats, & keep your stock axle back system.

George in PA did this & he is happy. I will have this set up with Kooks LT's when my car gets out of Vector's Shop! :woohoo:



...

[jbradsh1]

I've been following your posts and since you seem to be on the same path to performance improvements I'd really be interested in what kind of gain you realize, especially 1/4 mile time & speed. Let me know, would ya?

[00 Trans Ram]

I guess I have had Soooo many issues with headers (may have been cheap ones) leaking at the heads that I want NOTHING to do with them on my DD.

A lot of times it's the header flange thickness that makes the difference. For instance, both Hooker and Flowtech make LT headers for the 2000 LS1 F-body. Both companies are owned by Holley. And, both of the headers are the EXACT SAME design. However, the Hookers cost $894 whlie the flowtech costs $419.

Why the difference if the bends, collectors, etc are all the same? Well, the Hookers use a much thicker flange, and also thicker tubing. Their welds are also more consistent.

[jbradsh1]

So for our G8's, what's your opinion as to the best built and best performing LT header, and why?

[G8GTlawride]

So for our G8's, what's your opinion as to the best built and best performing LT header, and why?

Obviously the ones we bought!

[wreckwriter]

jeff, you really need to decide if your biggest want is performance or quiet. You can't have max performance at stock noise levels (i.e. none).

[G8GTlawride]

Yeah but if the headers didn't do anything with the stock cats then I believe the cats with the manifolds would be better than new cats and shorties but that's just me. I guess I have had Soooo many issues with headers (may have been cheap ones) leaking at the heads that I want NOTHING to do with them on my DD. I just know the more you muck with something the more you have chances of screwing the pooch.

I would love to know if those cats fit the stock manifolds. I would do that.

H-2's were widow makers!

Chris, I too have had bad luck with some headers in the past. From Hooker to Appliance to Hedman to you name it. They leaked, rusted, fell apart, hung too low and hit the high points in the road. But, the one thing that they wern't was made using today's technology and engineering and especially materials, such as stainless steel. I was more than a little worried when I made the decision to buy them. But, since they're on now and all is well I truly think all those ghosts in the closet are gone. They fit good, look good and especially run good AND they are not loud.

[jbradsh1]

I have, but VMS evidently doesn't want to install ARH's, only Kooks, which I don't want. Any suggestions? I also am going to have installed the VMS 93 tune, the hsrk, the roto-fab, and keep the stock mufflers. The only thing I haven't decided yet is whether to have the up installed or not. How's that for being decisive! I want VMS to do all of this work as I don't have the tools or the know how.

[G8GTlawride]

If you are going to get headers & don't want a ton of sound definitely get either Kooks or American Racing Long Tubes, High Flow cats, & keep your stock axle back system.

George in PA did this & he is happy. I will have this set up with Kooks LT's when my car gets out of Vector's Shop! :woohoo:




...

The only warranty issue you will have is whether the header CAUSED the malfunction. The other warranty issue you will have is if the headers have to be removed during a warranty repair. They will not remove them under any warranty. You will pay for that.

[GeorgeInNePa]

I have, but VMS evidently doesn't want to install ARH's, only Kooks, which I don't want. Any suggestions? I also am going to have installed the VMS 93 tune, the hsrk, the roto-fab, and keep the stock mufflers. The only thing I haven't decided yet is whether to have the up installed or not. How's that for being decisive! I want VMS to do all of this work as I don't have the tools or the know how.

Kook's, ARH, they're close enough to be the same, to you. Make sure VMS gets you a good deal on the Kooks, because you wanted the ARH, and just go with it. You can still run the stock mufflers with the Kooks LTs.

[jbradsh1]

Thanks, I'm looking at doing just that!

[jbradsh1]

Just got off the phone with the sales rep at Kooks. Had him check to see what rwhp the LT's made vs their new shorty header with high flow cats. He checked and his answer was 30 with the LT's vs 16-21 with the shorties. I think I'm going with the shorties as they bolt up to the stock exhaust system and the 30 rwhp obtained with the LT's was their full system all the way back. I'm going to talk with VMS to see what they say before making my final decision.

[G8Smitty]

Just got off the phone with the sales rep at Kooks. Had him check to see what rwhp the LT's made vs their new shorty header with high flow cats. He checked and his answer was 30 with the LT's vs 16-21 with the shorties. I think I'm going with the shorties as they bolt up to the stock exhaust system and the 30 rwhp obtained with the LT's was their full system all the way back. I'm going to talk with VMS to see what they say before making my final decision.

Did they give you a price?

[jbradsh1]

Yes, the Kooks shorties are $875 including the high flow cats, according to the Kooks sales rep I spoke with. VMS is checking this option out for me today. VMS is also installing a Kooks LT system with the stock mufflers today (their first such install according to Kirk). By the end of today I should have this all scoped out. I have an appt. with them for Oct 1st to have all the mods I want done installed (are you listening WreckWriter, I thought you'd be relieved to hear I have actually pulled the trigger).

[wreckwriter]

I just hope you're happy with the sound Jeff, whichever you get.

[jbradsh1]

Thanks WreckWriter, I appreciate the thought.

[jbradsh1]

Kirk at VMS also mentioned that the Kooks shorties actually have longer header pipes than others he has seen, which he seemed to think was a good thing.

[G8Smitty]

Keep us posted please. You have peaked my interest. :)

[jbradsh1]

Will do.

[jbradsh1]

I'm having VMS install the Kooks shorty headers with high flow cats ($865 quoted from Kooks but VMS is checking their cost with Kooks before giving me a final price) along with the roto-fab, hsrk, and the vector tune. This is scheduled for a week from this Wednesday. We may dyno the car, since VMS hasn't done a Kooks shorty header install as of yet, to my knowledge. There has been some interest expressed on the web site in this level of performance upgrade so I'll post the results and some 1/4 mile times & speeds as soon as I get back from Michigan (I live in Florida and I'm driving up to their shop). I'm hoping these upgrades will give a significant horsepower improvement but retain near stock noise levels (I personally really like the stock exhaust sound a lot).

[jbradsh1]

Here is the estimate from VMS to do the work I want to have done.

Estimate
Date
9/19/2008
Estimate #55
Name / Address
Jeff Bradshaw
Vector Motorsports
24291 Sorrentino Ct.
Clinton Twp., MI 48035
Project
Jeff, Kirk would like $350 deposit on parts.
Total Description
Qty Cost Total
G8 tune 349.99
Roto Fab CAI 300.00
Roto Fab Installation 35.00
GM HSRK 99.99
Kook's Shorty Headers 757.31
Headers Installation 550.00
6.00% 69.44
Total: $2,161.73

[GTPprix]

Here is the estimate from VMS to do the work I want to have done.

Estimate
Date
9/19/2008
Estimate #55
Name / Address
Jeff Bradshaw
Vector Motorsports
24291 Sorrentino Ct.
Clinton Twp., MI 48035
Project
Jeff, Kirk would like $350 deposit on parts.
Total Description
Qty Cost Total
G8 tune 349.99
Roto Fab CAI 300.00
Roto Fab Installation 35.00
GM HSRK 99.99
Kook's Shorty Headers 757.31
Headers Installation 550.00
6.00% 69.44
Total: $2,161.73

Gotta love reposting an email with a HUGE confidentiality agreement on the bottom LOL

[GRRRR8]

LMAO!!! So much for the not so fine print!

[GTPprix]

LMAO!!! So much for the not so fine print!

It's *8* lines long ROFL :D

[GRRRR8]

OH, I thought it was 15, no wonder! ROFLMAO!!!!!

[GTPprix]

15 would be funny, it would be longer than the estimate ROFL :D No big deal I just get a kick out of it :D

[wreckwriter]

Price is good so no worries?

[GTPprix]

no no its no big deal its just funny when people do it thats all ;)

[jbradsh1]

To VectorMotorsports: I am so sorry. There is no confidentiality agreement on the either the attached price quote or the e-mail! I thought I was doing you a favor i.e., some free promo for you as I know there is strong interest in your work & tunes, etc.! I won't post anything again if you prefer it that way. Jeff Bradshaw

[GTPprix]

It's fine Jeff I was just giving you a hard time :) No biggie, see ya on the 1st! :D

[jbradsh1]

Glad to hear it. Man, I'm glad you guys seem to have a good sense of humor. You need one when you're working with beginners like myself. But like the man said, you have to start sometime and where you start is where you are. What's your favorite beer, I'll bring you one.

[GRRRR8]

PARTY @ VECTOR! JEFFS BUYING!!! :drunk:

[GeorgeInNePa]

Did someone say beer?

:cheers:


:drunk:


:beer2:

:drunk2:

:beer3:

I like beer.



Of course, that's like saying a fish appreciates water.

[jbradsh1]

Not again!!! Oh well, ok!!!

[-Ray-]

You can always go back and edit your e-mail to remove the price quote. If anyone needs this done let 1 of the mods know and we'll be happy to do it.

Ray

[jbradsh1]

Thanks. Can you go ahead and do this WreckWriter or GRRRR8? If so, please do. Yes, I'll still buy the beer!