ARH vs KOOKS

[GRRRR8]

Today I had the opportunity to install KOOKS 1 3/4 on IXLR8s car. This review is not to say who is better, it is from a Master Technicians view point that has installed 100s of headers. Initial inspection shows the quality is excellent on the KOOKS. Installation is where I see the problems others are having. ARH uses a 1 piece X-pipe, meaning it slides on to the headers and you are done. KOOKS however uses 2 cats and the X with all ball flanges. Well, the KOOKS does not come with the spacers to increase the clearance on the trans tunnel brace, so I fugure I will make it work without them. After 1 hr and 10 minutes of adjusting I install 4 washers under each corner of the brace. Way to many pieces to adjust and that flex on the ball sockets when tightening. I got it perfect. That being said, I will install ARH with checking spark plug gaps and adjusting if necessary for $375. KOOKS will be $450. They sound the same with the stock muffs and they are very well made, but the additional time so there is absolutely no noise, hitting, etc has to be charged for as I didnt make it. I will not charge IXLR8 1 penny more then we agreed to as I estimated it off of the ARH install. When my name goes on something it has to be perfect and I wont cut corners just because something is different. To sum it up, ARH comes with everything for a perfect easy install and is a great product. KOOKS takes more time, you will need to order the spacers from ARH, and it too is a great product.

[KaiserM715]

Can you order the spacers directly from ARH? Good tips to know, my Kooks are "in the mail"...

[GRRRR8]

Yes you can. There is nothing wrong with KOOKS system. It will be more difficult on the ground do to all the necessary adjustments.

[MojaveG8]

Thanks for the info. Do we need the spacers for the ARHs?

[Mike@NewEra]

No, ARH comes with them. ARH fits like a glove on every car we have installed them on. We charge less to install ARH systems on all applications as well because of issues with others.

[r33pwrd]

a little secret when doing the kooks... this is very easy and works PERFECT!

Get everything bolted up (do not tighten the mid pipe, you should have the rear muffler and headers bolted on at this point) slide 3 pieces or cardboard between brace and exhaust... tight it all up (remove cardboard). this works amazing and the exhaust is no where near the cross brace.

[zosoboogie]

Today I had the opportunity to install KOOKS 1 3/4 on IXLR8s car. This review is not to say who is better, it is from a Master Technicians view point that has installed 100s of headers. Initial inspection shows the quality is excellent on the KOOKS. Installation is where I see the problems others are having. ARH uses a 1 piece X-pipe, meaning it slides on to the headers and you are done. KOOKS however uses 2 cats and the X with all ball flanges. Well, the KOOKS does not come with the spacers to increase the clearance on the trans tunnel brace, so I fugure I will make it work without them. After 1 hr and 10 minutes of adjusting I install 4 washers under each corner of the brace. Way to many pieces to adjust and that flex on the ball sockets when tightening. I got it perfect. That being said, I will install ARH with checking spark plug gaps and adjusting if necessary for $375. KOOKS will be $450. They sound the same with the stock muffs and they are very well made, but the additional time so there is absolutely no noise, hitting, etc has to be charged for as I didnt make it. I will not charge IXLR8 1 penny more then we agreed to as I estimated it off of the ARH install. When my name goes on something it has to be perfect and I wont cut corners just because something is different. To sum it up, ARH comes with everything for a perfect easy install and is a great product. KOOKS takes more time, you will need to order the spacers from ARH, and it too is a great product.

Wow if u install more then header can I get a quote and ship my car to you!!!

[GRRRR8]

Did that and then it was touching a trans crossmember bolt. I gave it every possible chance and then it was time to space it. Not to mention that it is almost touching the trans puke tube.

[G8GTlawride]

Can you order the spacers directly from ARH? Good tips to know, my Kooks are "in the mail"...

You can get galvanized versions at Lowes as well. They are just a tick larger in diamter but are otherwise the same.

[GRRRR8]

You can get galvanized versions at Lowes as well. They are just a tick larger in diamter but are otherwise the same.

True. 3/8 hole in any spacer will do. I used 4 3/8 washers, so a solid spacer that thickness work if you dont have time to order.

[GRRRR8]

Wow if u install more then header can I get a quote and ship my car to you!!!

Tell me what you want. :)

[Andy@Livernois]

Just an FYI all of the Kooks systems we sell include the spacers at no additional charge (even at the 1400 shipped special we are currently running). Now I know all of the ones we have installed haven't needed them, but we have seen cars that had the installs done prior to us working on them and they did have/need them. It just seems to be a mix of tolerances on the cars whether you will need them or not, but we have it arranged with Kooks to include them in all of there kits we purchase just in case...

[GRRRR8]

I think it is possible that some wont need them as its so close. The reason I say that is the Vararam specs between 2 G8s was about 1/2 inch difference, so it only makes sense that if the air intake clearances are off a little, then the exhaust must be too.

[todds87ss]

Damn..IXLR8 has headers now...after seeing the look in his eyes at Street Kings, I knew it was just a matter of time. Time to man up I guess...

[GRRRR8]

Damn..IXLR8 has headers now...after seeing the look in his eyes at Street Kings, I knew it was just a matter of time. Time to man up I guess...

Quit slackin Todd! lol

[Ktlplxm]

I noticed on my Kook's that it is possible to switch the Cat-pipes (driverside for passenger side) and it still bolt up; it just hits in places. I switched mine from the initial bolt up and now have all the clearance in the world. But like some have said, our tolerances taken into consideration...

[r33pwrd]

my kooks could have not been any easier to install... I used a lift so that does make it a litttle easier.

[GRRRR8]

my kooks could have not been any easier to install... I used a lift so that does make it a litttle easier.

Like I said, until you install both is when you will see what everyone that has is talking about.

['02 ws6]

Looks like this thread may have potentially made my mind up to go w/ ARH. I was torn at first, but have to take into account that the install will be done in my shop/storage unit w/o a lift. Thanks for the meticulous info Charlie.

[GRRRR8]

I just felt after 100s of PMs asking the difference and since I had the chance to do both, I would explain the differences. I have 250k in tools and a drive on rack and side post lifts.

[Mike P]

Damn..IXLR8 has headers now...after seeing the look in his eyes at Street Kings, I knew it was just a matter of time. Time to man up I guess...


Yea Todd, if you got the extra cash your car would love you for some American Racing 1 " 7/8 LT Headers! :)

You'll love them. Keep the stock axle back / mufflers and the sound is almost the same as stock except at WOT there is a nice rumble. And bliping the throttle gives a nice growl too..... :)


...

[IXLR8]

Yea Todd, if you got the extra cash your car would love you for some American Racing 1 " 7/8 LT Headers! :)

You'll love them. Keep the stock axle back / mufflers and the sound is almost the same as stock except at WOT there is a nice rumble. And bliping the throttle gives a nice growl too..... :)


...

I got em and I love em... Can't wait for the tune. Maybe Kirk will have mercy on me and expedite it...

[GRRRR8]

I got em and I love em... Can't wait for the tune. Maybe Kirk will have mercy on me and expedite it...

Well how do you like the power and the install?

[KaiserM715]

Get everything bolted up (do not tighten the mid pipe, you should have the rear muffler and headers bolted on at this point) slide 3 pieces or cardboard between brace and exhaust... tight it all up (remove cardboard). this works amazing and the exhaust is no where near the cross brace.

This is a good idea. I will give it a try next weekend when I put mine on. Is this with spacers or without?


Can't wait for the tune. Maybe Kirk will have mercy on me and expedite it...

Once the Vararam is out, maybe several of us can get together when Kirk comes down to do Charlie's car... (assuming that is reasonably soon).

[IXLR8]

Well how do you like the power and the install?

I may need to buy a belt sander. It may be the only way to remove the grin from my face...

[G8GT721]

I may need to buy a belt sander. It may be the only way to remove the grin from my face...

i thought you were gooing to say to get the rubber of the back fenders

[r33pwrd]

This is a good idea. I will give it a try next weekend when I put mine on. Is this with spacers or without?



Once the Vararam is out, maybe several of us can get together when Kirk comes down to do Charlie's car... (assuming that is reasonably soon).

No spacers needed... I have now done two sets and both where SOOOOO easy. Not nocking the ARH but if the kooks where any easier my 17 month old could do them. maybe I have been lucky or something?? the only thing I had to do what cut off a small bolt in the rear by the gas tank (just excess thread) and if you do it while pipe is off it takes about 10 seconds with a hacksaw. The second set we did in under an hour and a half with 2 people.

[GRRRR8]

No spacers needed... I have now done two sets and both where SOOOOO easy. Not nocking the ARH but if the kooks where any easier my 17 month old could do them. maybe I have been lucky or something?? the only thing I had to do what cut off a small bolt in the rear by the gas tank (just excess thread) and if you do it while pipe is off it takes about 10 seconds with a hacksaw. The second set we did in under an hour and a half with 2 people.

I didnt have to cut any stud or anything on my install. Just another sign of product/vehicle inconsistencies.

[IXLR8]

Comparison between stock and Kooks/Roto-Fab. I have been using a G-Tech Competition to track times on my cars since 2000. Is it absolutely accurate? No, but does offer me a comparison for several vehicles I have owned. I have made several runs at two tracks for a baseline with a stock G8 car. It takes in to account car weight and acceleration to calculate horsepower and torque curves. It is able to measure RPM through alternator whine in the electrical system, and it works very well. Amazingly the stats are in the ballpark and repeatable.

CAI + Headers = 40 hp on my car. I am waiting for the tune, whenever the VMS tuner becomes available. Dashhawk measurment went from 4.85 to 4.57 0 to 60, but I never did believe it. The G-Tech shows a drop from 5.3 to 5.1 second 0-60. I tend to believe it. I also get 1/10 G better acceleration .7G vs .6G stock.

[r33pwrd]

I didnt have to cut any stud or anything on my install. Just another sign of product/vehicle inconsistencies.

honestly if i had used spacers on tunnel brace and let exhasut sit lower i would not have had to cut them but i wanted the exhuast up as high as possible. They did not hit the bolt but very close! I bet I have almost 3/8 inch gap between exhaust and brace (if not more)