Steering wheel shake

[tolrtd]

[deleted thread]

[MongosG8]

I'm sure others will chime in soon that had similar experiences. I'm having a similar problem and they tell me my rotors are fine and wheels are balanced.

Its possible it might be your LCAs. lower control arms.
There is a huge thread about this issue. There is also a bulletin on the problem.
Now getting the dealer to admit that there is a problem and getting the new LCAs will be a whole different story if its indeed related to the LCAs.

[MongosG8]

Last year I had the service bulletin about the clunking/knocking in the front suspension done - not sure if that's the same thing you are talking about - where they did something with a rubber boot that would freeze up in the winter.

Yeah I had that done also.. This is something that's totally different.

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

If the rotors were warped it would shake when you apply the brakes. You probably have tread walk in the tires, this is a condition where the tread isn't running true to the sides of the tires and it causes the steering wheel to shake.

[HuskerG8]

Update, the dealer boiled it down to warped rotors and brake pads in the front because of my painted calipers not allowing heat to escape and overheating them. Sounds suspicious but it's covered under warranty so I won't complain. Parts will take 4-5 days to get here so we will see if it fixes the issue.

I hope this fixes it for you. I am having the same issue but at speeds of 70mph or higher. Give just a little left steering input and the it starts to shake like crazy. I have roadforced balanced the tires, tried three different right front tires and the problem remains. Dealer won't work on mine anymore with the Pedders Track II set up so I have been working with a local suspension shop.

I had the issue earlier this year under lower speeds. That time we adjusted the alignment since the camber was actually +.2 degrees in the front. We changed it to -1.0 and the vibration was gone. With that fixing it at that point it seemed the wheel was essentially tripping over itself and wasn't keeping a large enough tire patch on the ground.

It has now come back but under the higher speeds. Checked the alignment again, and it was still good. We went ahead and increased the camber to about -1.3 and still there. We tried disconnecting the sway bar and it would occur at lower speeds. We pulled the right front strut and all seemed to be okay. The strut and strut bearing were fine. I haven't been able to leave the car to do further checking, but we were going to check the rotors and wheel hub next. I do not have any shaking under high or low speed braking. The wheel hub doesn't make any noise and there is no wheel movement if you grab the tire at 3 and 9 and try to move it side to side. I have already had the radius rods replaced earlier this year. The only other thing at this point would be the lower control arm, tie rod or maybe the steering rack. I don't get any popping noises when driving slowly so if it is the control arm, it isn't presenting the usual indications people are getting.

After dealing with suspension issues earlier this year and now this, I am about ready to give up and get something different.

Again, good luck with yours and I hope it fixes it.

[todds87ss]

[QUOTE=HuskerG8;323083] The wheel hub doesn't make any noise and there is no wheel movement if you grab the tire at 3 and 9 and try to move it side to side. I have already had the radius rods replaced earlier this year. The only other thing at this point would be the lower control arm, tie rod or maybe the steering rack. I don't get any popping noises when driving slowly so if it is the control arm, it isn't presenting the usual indications people are getting.

QUOTE]

This very much sounds like worn suspension components, particularly those that would maintain steering geometry under cornering forces. Tie rods or LCAs. Try grapping the wheel also at 12 and 6 and test for motion. There has to be something there.

[MongosG8]

Looks like you may have been right all along. They are ordering new control arms and putting them on the car tomorrow. At least I got new rotors & pads for the trouble.

Really glad they are now looking at the LCAs. Im still working on my dealer to do the same. You got a good point .. your getting a complete brake job for your troubles ..:thumbsup:

I hope this turns out to be the problem and resolves the issue. Keep in touch and let us know how you make out.

[BR*]

you might wanna try the air pressure as well,,,, i had issuse as well,,, wheels need to be cold, check tire pressure and make it 8 pounds under the maximum cold tire pressure on the side of the tire.In about a week of driving it went from shakes to smooth.

[BR*]

I now run all my tires on my car and truck 8 pounds under the maxium cold tire pressure,,, it has proven to be the best ride on both in winter and summer.

[Strykersg8gt]

I now run all my tires on my car and truck 8 pounds under the maxium cold tire pressure,,, it has proven to be the best ride on both in winter and summer.

When you say the maxium are you refering too whats on the the inside of the door panel or what is on the tire?

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

My tires (Eagle GT) are smooth at any speed whether I have 32 or 40 pounds in them.

[SpeedRacerX]

Dealer replaced the 4 LCA's. Problem solved.

So that was it? It really made all the difference?

Dealer has done everything to my car including a new driveshaft and I still get the shakes.
They are very good to me but look at me like I have three heads when I mention they should look at the LCAs.
They seem to think that's the "boot" thing they did when my car was very new.

I have to take it in one morning this week for the updated gas cap they ordered and I already told them I wanted them to inspect the suspension because it's still shaking. We'll see.

I'm glad this worked out for you. Must be a huge feeling of relief and resolve.

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

Quite a few LCA's have broken, so if they are worn then it could cause a lot of damage.

[MongosG8]

Yes, it went from being a terrible, speed-independent shake when the wheel was turned to 11:30 or 12:30, to a smooth ride. I took it around the "model corner" (an off ramp near me) before and after and it is like night and day. I took it around the corner after they replaced the front rotors & pads and it still shook (however, some shaking while braking went away). I had the "boot thing" done to my car back in October 09 and it seems to be independent of that too. At first, the dealer didn't seem to be actively looking for a solution, but when I told them that a mechanic friend of mine suggested the LCA's (a mechanic friend = the wonderful GRRRR8 community), they came back to me with "we diagnosed it as the control arms and will replace them for you". I had my car back within 6 hours of dropping it off for the operation and the invoice said the control arms were worn.

It's not like this was the end of the world - I don't think it would have caused much damage - but it was certainly annoying especially for a car under warranty. Best of luck and I might suggest bringing them for a ride so they can see it first hand.



Excellent ..Glad to hear they done their job and resolved this problem for you.
I had a feeling the LCAs were the problem.

When I tell them there is a problem with the LCAs they seem not believe me like I don't know WTF I'm talking about. Its starting to get old bringing this up all the time with the dealer.
Now I need to be a thorn in my dealers side ..I have a list of things they need to fix so I guess its time to take it out of winter storage and lite a fire under their ass to get it done.

I just want all problems fixed considering I might be selling the G8 this coming spring/summer.

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

Mark I can't believe the dealer is giving you the runaround on replacing the LCA's. It seems to me you need to find another dealer. I took my car to the dealer about a year ago, and when I told them I had a low speed rattle they ordered the LCA's and replaced them when they came in. It's strange how some dealers will replace them with no trouble at all and others are so against it. If you don't get any cooperation from your dealer, you can always contact the GM rep and that usually gets results.

[MongosG8]

Mark I can't believe the dealer is giving you the runaround on replacing the LCA's. It seems to me you need to find another dealer. I took my car to the dealer about a year ago, and when I told them I had a low speed rattle they ordered the LCA's and replaced them when they came in. It's strange how some dealers will replace them with no trouble at all and others are so against it. If you don't get any cooperation from your dealer, you can always contact the GM rep and that usually gets results.


Don .. I agree.
This dealer was always great to me considering the original dealer where I purchased the G8 from are just a bunch of dumb fucks.

My G8 didn't have too many issues. I'm just starting to see a few of the problems others are complaining about. LCAs, Rear Seal & Possible Lifter tick.

The service adviser that was taking care of me at this dealer has left the dept ..she was awesome! Now there is another guy that took over who is questioning everything thing I mention to them that's giving me a problem ..(Issues I mentioned above). They do not want to bother or admit there is a problem. (This was my 3rd dealer) Since purchase. I don't think there is any dealer left around me to go to. I have been to all of them in my area. This one who was my original Pontiac dealer back in the day where I purchased my Grand Prix & Formula from.

I Love my G8 .. But I have little tolerance for this shit. Thats why I'm going to considering selling it ..unless the service dept. has a change of heart.

[MongosG8]

Being my neighbor and all, do you mind sharing which dealer(s) you've been to?

LOL!!! Ok Neighbor! ..So true considering your only in Milford.

Purchased from D`Addario but there service dept is clueless.
Went to Bobs of Milford .. but since I didn't purchase my G8 from them they wouldn't touch my car ..their exact words. I gotten the same Response from Wallingford.

Last is G&J Pontiac of Fairfield .. these guys have been great up til recently when the service advisor left.
I just called them & Was told to ask for ED the new guy in charge & tell him about the issues and tell him that I was recommended by the Master Tech (Who takes care of my G8 like his own) ..so maybe this can be settled.

[MongosG8]

Interesting. I purchased mine from Wallingford - the drive was too much trouble for service and the people there were very difficult to work with. Seeing as Bob's is 3 minutes from my home (and 10 from my work), I've been going there lately. A couple of months back they cleaned house and now they have a pretty decent service crew. I can definitely imagine the "old" crew telling you they won't work on your car if you didn't buy it there, but I didn't buy mine there and they have been servicing it since 9/09. If you make it known that you're very meticulous and don't want to be toyed with, they seem to respect that.

Hopefully G&J is better - but if not, Bob's didn't seem to have a problem replacing my LCA's this time around and with it fresh in their mind they might do that for you as well.

I agree the guys in Wally World were very difficult people ..after telling me over the phone to bring it up & driving 30 minutes all the way up there they tell me sorry but cant help you. I ended up reporting them to GM.

Bobs was around the time you mentioned so I'm sure they were the old crew working there.
Nice to know the new crew was willing to help.
G&J have always been great. I did purchase cars there in the past .. we will see when I speak to the new service manager. Like I said the Master Tech who has been working on my car for over a year wants me to talk to him first. If I get the same result I will try the new crew in Milford.

I really appreciate you telling me this ..like you stated they might be more willing to help me considering its still fresh in their heads since you brought in your G8.

I will keep you guys posted. Thanks again!

[SpeedRacerX]

Well, they replaced my gas cap with the new one. They did a suspension inspection. Even showed me everything while it was up on the lift - dealer is very cool to me. LCAs were tight. Nothing moved, could not get movement out of the tire & wheel at all. After everything they've checked, I'm calling it case closed. The only thing left that was never done was a road force balance of the tires. Maybe I'll try that this Spring but I am done worrying about a slight pull and a slight shake.

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

Are you getting the shake with the aftermarket wheels & tires or the stockers?

[SpeedRacerX]

Are you getting the shake with the aftermarket wheels & tires or the stockers?

Both but it's much less with the stockers. Probably worse because the aftermarkets are staggered.

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

More than likely it's a problem with the car then. It could be a warped rotor(s). If you rotate the stockers does it go away or is it the same? Also do you know if the aftermarket set was road force balanced?

[SpeedRacerX]

More than likely it's a problem with the car then. It could be a warped rotor(s). If you rotate the stockers does it go away or is it the same? Also do you know if the aftermarket set was road force balanced?

They checked the rotors as part of the whole big TSB they followed...tires, alignment, brakes, motor mounts, driveshaft, etc. Rotating did not help. Tried that, stays about the same. Neither set was RFB'd. I should have an independent shop check the rotors and I guess get the aftermarket set RFB'd since it's off the car for the winter anyway...actually might be selling my current staggered setup to move to something bigger.

[DRCUSTOMPARTS]

A road force balance might do the trick since they checked your car out pretty thoroughly.

[MongosG8]

They tried to tell me that the problem was due to my Camaro rims I installed.
I told them they were checked and the rims were balanced perfectly prior to installation. I also explained after they installation I had them road balanced. Never had a problem before.
They told me they will reschedule me and do a complete check again this time including all suspension and brakes. Very surprised they didn't check these originally. But I'm happy they are willing to do a complete check again.

[Virus]

Jack your car up, make certain it's sitting flush with the hub, do a firm tightening and then make sure to torque each lug nut to 125 ft/lbs. This is crucial for our cars. Just a hair off from sitting flush and it will vibrate!

[G8V8]

Jack your car up, make certain it's sitting flush with the hub, do a firm tightening and then make sure to torque each lug nut to 125 ft/lbs. This is crucial for our cars. Just a hair off from sitting flush and it will vibrate!

We have done this with virus' car and mine and it really worked for both of us. Make sure the whell is flush on the hub, tighten in several passes in a star pattern until the nuts are snug and then torque in a star pattern making sure to do both with the tires off the ground. What you want to do is treat these as if they are wheel-centric, not hub-centric.

[SpeedRacerX]

We have done this with virus' car and mine and it really worked for both of us. Make sure the whell is flush on the hub, tighten in several passes in a star pattern until the nuts are snug and then torque in a star pattern making sure to do both with the tires off the ground. What you want to do is treat these as if they are wheel-centric, not hub-centric.

Do you mean "lug centric" rather than hub centric?

You know, I never liked the way my hub rings fit on my staggered wheels and that set had a little more shake than the stock a/s (not much but enough to bother someone as particular as I am). When I put them back on in the Spring, I am going to try to just use the lugs and tighten as you described. Maybe the rings had things just a little "cocked" on there!?!?!?

[Virus]

Do you mean "lug centric" rather than hub centric?

You know, I never liked the way my hub rings fit on my staggered wheels and that set had a little more shake than the stock a/s (not much but enough to bother someone as particular as I am). When I put them back on in the Spring, I am going to try to just use the lugs and tighten as you described. Maybe the rings had things just a little "cocked" on there!?!?!?

It makes a huge difference. I thought I was careful one time putting them on and everything looked ok, but I had terrible steering wheel shake. I jacked the car up loosened the lugs again and made sure the rims were sitting flat against the hub, tightened then torqued in a star pattern and the vibration completely went away. Our cars are terrible with this!

[G8V8]

Do you mean "lug centric" rather than hub centric?

You know, I never liked the way my hub rings fit on my staggered wheels and that set had a little more shake than the stock a/s (not much but enough to bother someone as particular as I am). When I put them back on in the Spring, I am going to try to just use the lugs and tighten as you described. Maybe the rings had things just a little "cocked" on there!?!?!?

Lug-centric is the right phrase I think. Letting the lugs position the wheel as opposed to letting the hub center it. If done right hubcentric is better but if the hub and the hole in the wheel are not made correctly, they can get you in trouble. I had custom aluminum spacers made and they were wheel-centric (spacer was cut to just fit the hole in the wheel) and hub-centric (spacer wascut to just fit over the hub). Amazing improvement. Our hubs are 66.9mm and my wheels are 73.1mm. Standard rings are 66.7mm and 73 mm. This was too much slop and it allowed the wheel to be tightend slightly off center if you put wieght on it.

[BlackGT5]

Lug-centric is the right phrase I think. Letting the lugs position the wheel as opposed to letting the hub center it. If done right hubcentric is better but if the hub and the hole in the wheel are not made correctly, they can get you in trouble. I had custom aluminum spacers made and they were wheel-centric (spacer was cut to just fit the hole in the wheel) and hub-centric (spacer wascut to just fit over the hub). Amazing improvement. Our hubs are 66.9mm and my wheels are 73.1mm. Standard rings are 66.7mm and 73 mm. This was too much slop and it allowed the wheel to be tightend slightly off center if you put wieght on it.

Where did you get the custom rings from?

[G8V8]

Where did you get the custom rings from?

Here. (http://www.motorsport-tech.com/hub_rings.html)