Which mods do you regret?

[Voice of Reason]

In an effort to help everyone out who's doing mods, which ones have you done that you regret? We all want our cars to handle/accelerate/sound/etc better, but sometimes there are trade offs that people may not realize. And trial and error can get expensive. So if you've done something that has had an undesirable impact can you post it for the rest of us?

I'll start out. Only mod I would do differently so far is my G2 painted calipers. I have a big post around here somewhere about it, but I do not recommend smoothing the calipers first before you paint. You'll get sags, and I'm a perfectionist so in the spring I'm going to have to redo it.

[MGM GT]

SuperChips Cortex programmer

Magnaflow exhaust

Vararam & OPG intakes

Painting my GT valance before getting a GXP one.

[jellis]

my only regretted mod (which was on my GTO) was the C/F hood. it looked cool as hell to me, but it just wasn't worth the price and the hassle.

in being conservative with the G8 mods, hopefully we won't regret any of those mods.

[Ktlplxm]

Pedders springs
Vararam

[Voice of Reason]

Pedders springs
Vararam

Oooo, you're the first person I've seen to regret a pedders mod, and it's something I'm considering long term. Can you give some info on that? Too harsh a ride?

[Rican219]

SuperChips Cortex programmer

Really? PM me I just got mine because the guy who was tuning my car lost my tunes in a hard drive crash and moved away.

[Ktlplxm]

Oooo, you're the first person I've seen to regret a pedders mod, and it's something I'm considering long term. Can you give some info on that? Too harsh a ride?

The front was fine, the ride wasn't any stiffer than the Eibachs. The rear was a pain in the ass. The rears (2955) sat so low I had to pull my wheels off to even drive the car, sure with the Eibachs it would scrub a little with extra people in the car ver big bumps, but with the Pedders with just me in the car it would scrub over EVERY bump in the road. The spring itself even felt weaker. I switched to the Pedders from Eibach because I wanted something a little higher and a little stiffer, both of which Pedders said the 2955/2954 package would do, neither of which was true in this case. When I informed them of the issue and Rob @ Wretched got them to send me the next higher spring (which shouldve been the 2957, OE Height HD, but actually lower than stock) they instead sent the 7955 which is taller than stock (but still says OE height HD on their website as well, quite contradictory). I installed them just in case, hoping they would be lower than advertised like the 2955 was, but was sadly mistaken. They did sit noticeably higher than my stock springs did. I was told it was because I had Koni's on the car, so I switched them out to the stock ones; exact same ride height, exact same softness. I eventually put the Eibachs back on the car all the way around. When I disassembled the fronts to change the springs back to the Eibachs, the brand new Pedders bearing was broken. when I brought that up, they said I installed it incorrectly and put it in a bind and broke it (funny considering the I didn't break the factory ones after several suspension changes, and once the bearing is installed in the bushing it cannot really move around). In the end I gave the front springs to a friend, I'm still stuck with a pair of useless rear springs, and a broken bearing, and spent hours and hours changing things trying to make their product work. Of all the Pedders I've bought the only thing that work exactly as described were the sway bars. Pedders USA I have no use for, but Rob@ wretched did all he could to make everything right, he's great to work with

[Voice of Reason]

Thanks for the info Ktlplxm! That's the kind of detail I was hoping to see in this thread. I think too many times people are afraid to come forward when something doesn't work out, either out of pride or insecurity. But by giving us all the real scoop we can make sure others don't repeat our mistakes.

[jdeserio]

Pedders springs
Vararam

why vararam?

[Ktlplxm]

Thanks for the info Ktlplxm! That's the kind of detail I was hoping to see in this thread. I think too many times people are afraid to come forward when something doesn't work out, either out of pride or insecurity. But by giving us all the real scoop we can make sure others don't repeat our mistakes.

No problem. I hate to see people buy things just because of the name attached, or hear about them having issues that I've had when I couldve warned them before. I'm sure at some point someone will point out the fact that COMPANY_X been around for XX amount of years and they have COMPANY_X products on their car, or that COMPANY_X is a sponsor and shouldn't be spoken poorly about. And its not just the one I've I already mentioned, but others such as FAST. I didn't bring them up because I didn't install their new intake on a stock 6.0 engine and see XX amount of gain, but I did install it on 7.0 and saw very VERY little (certainly not enough to justify buying one).

[Ktlplxm]

why vararam?

1-Fitment

2-Radiator movement

3-Flimsy

4-Insubstantial gains over an AFE or Rotofab
(actually I didn't see anymore than 1-2 on the dyno, no decrease in track ET, or increase in track MPH)

I pulled mine back off and traded it to another User for his Rotofab. Lost nothing in the trade off aesthetically or performance-wise

[GeorgeInNePa]

1-Fitment

2-Radiator movement

3-Flimsy

4-Insubstantial gains over an AFE or Rotofab
(actually I didn't see anymore than 1-2 on the dyno, no decrease in track ET, or increase in track MPH)

I pulled mine back off and traded it to another User for his Rotofab. Lost nothing in the trade off aesthetically or performance-wise

Honestly, I don't know if there is really a difference between any of the CAIs except for the look.

Drugs and I are running essentially the same ET and MPH (yes he has run .03 quicker ;)). He runs a New Era Pod Style, I use a Vararam.

[pokey]

Bright Red G2 Painted calipers.

The paint rocks, no issues. Color is my regret. The red reminds me of what a young kid driving a ricer would do to thier car. I'm thinking of redoing them at some point back to silver or maybe a gray.

[Voice of Reason]

Bright Red G2 Painted calipers.

The paint rocks, no issues. Color is my regret. The red reminds me of what a young kid driving a ricer would do to thier car. I'm thinking of redoing them at some point back to silver or maybe a gray.

I'm using silver right now and it almost looks like unpainted calipers. I'm thinking about buying a silver and black caliper set to mix together for something in the middle.

[jdeserio]

1-Fitment

2-Radiator movement

3-Flimsy

4-Insubstantial gains over an AFE or Rotofab
(actually I didn't see anymore than 1-2 on the dyno, no decrease in track ET, or increase in track MPH)

I pulled mine back off and traded it to another User for his Rotofab. Lost nothing in the trade off aesthetically or performance-wise

I find that hard to believe. Anytime you eliminate that kink or bend, you should have colder air quicker and more power, but I guess it really wasn't that much more..Man I do feel on the flimsy and radiator movement part..

[Belo]

people need to post the mod AND why, otherwise it's a useless statement that will only lead to more posts asking why...

[GTPprix]

35W HID Fog Lamps... Cooked both housings :(

[Devilish34]

Maganflow axle backs..................Drone

[bwooten492]

my tune from HPE. It was a waste of 400 bucks.
Mozilla/5.0 440x240 Samsung SCH-U940 NetFront/3.4

[pancho]

This is an excellent thread...Thanks!!:woohoo:

[BlueJacket]

Bright Red G2 Painted calipers.

The paint rocks, no issues. Color is my regret. The red reminds me of what a young kid driving a ricer would do to thier car. I'm thinking of redoing them at some point back to silver or maybe a gray.

Did you do both the calipers and brackets red? If so redo the brackets in black and it will look much better.

[ashaal]

Are people really not seeing track gains with the Vararam over the Rotofab. I understand they dyno the same, but I thought the whole argument was the RAM EFFECT and the difference would show up on the track.

This spring I will be getting one of these intakes and a tune from Vector/Livernois...If the Vararam doesn't actually perform any better than the Rotofab I will most likely go with the Rotofab. Can anyone else chime in on this?

[Mighty Horse]

Bully Dog Watchdog.... Doesn't read IAT as advertised. I do like the display and buttons but should have went with a Dashawk.

PowerFlash.... Can't figure out how to use the damn thing to data log!

[-Ray-]

Are people really not seeing track gains with the Vararam over the Rotofab. I understand they dyno the same, but I thought the whole argument was the RAM EFFECT and the difference would show up on the track.

This spring I will be getting one of these intakes and a tune from Vector/Livernois...If the Vararam doesn't actually perform any better than the Rotofab I will most likely go with the Rotofab. Can anyone else chime in on this?
I've had both. Prefer the Vararam.

[Dan's G8]

Repainting the stock front fascia before my wife cracked it on a parking chaulk. :(

[Devilish34]

I find that hard to believe. Anytime you eliminate that kink or bend, you should have colder air quicker and more power, but I guess it really wasn't that much more..Man I do feel on the flimsy and radiator movement part..

When I swapped out my New Era side mount for a Vararam my car felt like it pulled harder at highway speeds.

[Ktlplxm]

35W HID Fog Lamps... Cooked both housings :(

I completely forgot about those. After my lenses burned I just ditched the lights all together and ran duct work to my CAI


Are people really not seeing track gains with the Vararam over the Rotofab. I understand they dyno the same, but I thought the whole argument was the RAM EFFECT and the difference would show up on the track.

This spring I will be getting one of these intakes and a tune from Vector/Livernois...If the Vararam doesn't actually perform any better than the Rotofab I will most likely go with the Rotofab. Can anyone else chime in on this?

The best thing about "RAM AIR EFFECT" is that its hard to prove or quantify. Plus I'm not saying that it may not feel stronger on others' cars, it just didn't make any difference on mine. Couple that with the other reasons I listed for disliking it and ditching it was a no brainer for me.


I've had both. Prefer the Vararam.

In the end thats all it really comes down to; preference

[fiveoh]

BMR rear trailing arms... did nothing for my wheel hop which is why I ordered them.

[Ktlplxm]

BMR rear trailing arms... did nothing for my wheel hop which is why I ordered them.

Thats just lack of power, make enough and you'll spin through it!!:stooges:

Just kidding, couldn't help myself

[grandmacpubah]

NEP OTR...I think everyone knows why...$350 wasted because I wouldn't sell it.

Possibly the vararam, but only because I don't think it will fit with a maggie, not because of performance issues. In fact I'd be ecstatic if it fit, but doesn't look like it will.

[zosoboogie]

1. Magnaflow exhaust - 1st one to come out so I jumped on it now I have the kooks exhaust
2. Blighlights.com 3000K Fog lights I can't use because they are to bright -From BlingLight.com ---DO NOT RECOMMEND AT ALL HUGE WASTE OF MONEY
3. Llumar clear bra - took it off after a while you could of seen the line where it ended a mile away


Then there were a few things that didn't work during install a messed up torque converter and a few other things.

[r33pwrd]

NEP OTR...I think everyone knows why...$350 wasted because I wouldn't sell it.

Possibly the vararam, but only because I don't think it will fit with a maggie, not because of performance issues. In fact I'd be ecstatic if it fit, but doesn't look like it will.

we can make it work! Im very good with fiberglass and Plastic!

[MoonPie]

Front splash guards->held fine gravel, dirt and other shit against the paint. Now that I think about it, they looked goofy too...

[ddcook08]

Vararam.

[99-LS1-SS]

Honestly, I don't know if there is really a difference between any of the CAIs except for the look.


I think this is the case as well.

[Voice of Reason]

3. Llumar clear bra - took it off after a while you could of seen the line where it ended a mile away


Ooooooo, I completely blocked out my clear bra issues! I purchased a pre-cut set from an online company and it was a complete disaster to install. It turned out to be a giant wadded up expensive piece of plastic in my garbage. No one should ever EVER attempt to install it yourself unless your vehicle is a perfectly smooth and square box.

[SpeedRacerX]

Grrrr8 Thread.

The only mod I regret is the one I haven't shelled out the money and sweated to get done yet! :nah:

Seriously though, it would be my MGP red caliper covers for obvious reasons. They will be gone when the new wheels and tires go on.

[KaheeNalu]

NEP OTR...I think everyone knows why...$350 wasted because I wouldn't sell it.

Possibly the vararam, but only because I don't think it will fit with a maggie, not because of performance issues. In fact I'd be ecstatic if it fit, but doesn't look like it will.

I spoke to the Vararam rep when the system came out and they told me they could fit the Vararam to the maggie. Might want to give them a call.

[fiveoh]

Thats just lack of power, make enough and you'll spin through it!!:stooges:

Just kidding, couldn't help myself

:nah: I know I keep talking myself in and out of putting a new cam in it.

[Devilish34]

:nah: I know I keep talking myself in and out of putting a new cam in it.


Do it...There are cams that don't need a stall ;)

[G8GT721]

do it

[GR/G8/GT]

Ooooooo, I completely blocked out my clear bra issues! I purchased a pre-cut set from an online company and it was a complete disaster to install. It turned out to be a giant wadded up expensive piece of plastic in my garbage. No one should ever EVER attempt to install it yourself unless your vehicle is a perfectly smooth and square box.

Sorry yours didn't work out too well. I have not tried the brand mentioned, but the Invisible Mask I have wasn't too bad. Some brands are stiffer than others (I've heard 3M is one of them) and should only be installed by a professional. The Invisible Mask is maybe a little more pliable and went on with some difficulty, but with a little patience and an extra set of hands, it went well enough. The only part I wasn't successful with was at a few edges, which didn't adhere too well because they were along inside curves. Thus far, I have no additional chips in the paint, although the clear bra took a hit on the hood that actually tore clear through.

I'm leaving mine on, and can't say how long it will last, but for now it's working as advertised and visually isn't very obvious without looking closely. I'd recommend it, but only for someone who has help and a willingness to work the material around some complex curves. The G8 has some curves around the hood scoops and at the bumper corners that will be a challenge. Don't expect it to be a 30 minute job, follow the instructions carefully, and it will work fine. It's not a mod I regret.

[Blackdevil77]

I don't really regret any of my mods except for maybe the magnaflow mufflers. They sound great and all, but the drone does get kinda old, I probably would of went with kooks if I had to choose all over again.

And this isn't really a regret, but I did find out AFTER getting the cam, that replacing the springs is typical mantainence on a cammed car, which I'm sure isn't gonna be fun. But hey, at least I have a mild cam ;)

[99-LS1-SS]

BMR rear trailing arms... did nothing for my wheel hop which is why I ordered them.

I've done just about everything for wheel hop and now I'm down to the GForce axles....

[jellis]

my tune from HPE. It was a waste of 400 bucks.
Mozilla/5.0 440x240 Samsung SCH-U940 NetFront/3.4

when did you get the tune and who did it for you? Owen or someone else???

Owen is now gone and i'm about to start my mods, i felt that he did a good job on the wife GTO, but left some tq behind after the cam and stall, maybe because she was a "she" and not a he. I went in for a re-tune when it started getting colder weather, Owen had since left and was replaced by Wade (i think) and he added 20 ft lb of tq for us that "Owen left on the table". after that, the car was def BETTER!

[99-LS1-SS]

I spoke to the Vararam rep when the system came out and they told me they could fit the Vararam to the maggie. Might want to give them a call.

I'd be interested in seeing a Vararam on a supercharged G8. To my knowledge it hasn't been done.

[GRRRR8]

I'd be interested in seeing a Vararam on a supercharged G8. To my knowledge it hasn't been done.

Call Vararam. They said it can be done. :)

[fiveoh]

Do it...There are cams that don't need a stall ;)

I keep telling myself that... I bought the g8 to have a DD that wasnt too molested since the mustang got too wild to DD...(and to get better mileage) we'll see how this year treats me financially. I'm also watching you cammed guys closely to see what kind(if any) reliability issues yall run into from doing the cam.

[Ktlplxm]

I keep telling myself that... I bought the g8 to have a DD that wasnt too molested since the mustang got too wild to DD...(and to get better mileage) we'll see how this year treats me financially. I'm also watching you cammed guys closely to see what kind(if any) reliability issues yall run into from doing the cam.

:nah: How long are you wanting to wait and watch? Plenty of us have been cammed for well over a year now without any issues. My cam didn't require a converter in a 6.0, and it was very driveable/reliable

[G8V8]

Pedders springs
Vararam

Wow. My Pedders experiences and parts are the absolute favorite thing I've done. Sorry to hear your displeasure.

For me it was the Magnaflow catback. More drone than expected from the Street Series.

[fiveoh]

:nah: How long are you wanting to wait and watch? Plenty of us have been cammed for well over a year now without any issues. My cam didn't require a converter in a 6.0, and it was very driveable/reliable

Until my wallet is ready. :)

[G8GT594]

My yank that flashes at 4600 and left me SOL.

[Mike P]

:nah: How long are you wanting to wait and watch? Plenty of us have been cammed for well over a year now without any issues. My cam didn't require a converter in a 6.0, and it was very driveable/reliable


+1 for a smaller non dod cam on a daily driver (222/230 or a little smaller) with no converter and no issues.....

Do it 5 - 0 :)



...

[Mike P]

What's up Paul!? :)



...

[alex94z]

Magnaflow street series catback. Drone from the AFM was horrible. It would have been acceptable on a GXP or if i had turned off the AFM but i was not planning to.

[TLS]

SuperChips Cortex programmer



I don't think you ever explained the reason you listed the Cortex as being a regrettable mod.

Care to share?

Lots of people speak highly of this mod being the best bang for the buck....hands down.

[SRG963]

I don't think you ever explained the reason you listed the Cortex as being a regrettable mod.

Care to share?

Lots of people speak highly of this mod being the best bang for the buck....hands down.
He modded above the Cortex limits.
http://www.forum.grrrr8.net/showthread.php?t=12411

[G8Smitty]

Regretted Mod: Bug Deflector

Reason: It's Gay

[bwooten492]

when did you get the tune and who did it for you? Owen or someone else???

Owen is now gone and i'm about to start my mods, i felt that he did a good job on the wife GTO, but left some tq behind after the cam and stall, maybe because she was a "she" and not a he. I went in for a re-tune when it started getting colder weather, Owen had since left and was replaced by Austin (i think) and he added 20 ft lb of tq for us that "Owen left on the table". after that, the car was def BETTER!

Yeah Owen did my tune. IMO it did nothing but raise shift points and that type of stuff. We looked on HPTuners after and all the timing tables were stock and the car didnt pull any harder. All i got out of it was a dyno number.
Mozilla/5.0 440x240 Samsung SCH-U940 NetFront/3.4

[MGM GT]

I don't think you ever explained the reason you listed the Cortex as being a regrettable mod.

Care to share?

Lots of people speak highly of this mod being the best bang for the buck....hands down.

I kept it to PM with the person that asked.

Its good when you are stock or close to stock and just want something to fiddle with. There are always gains to be had from a dyno tune especially when its the same price! Some swear by it some hate it... much like the Vararam which is popular but on this list as well.



He modded above the Cortex limits.
http://www.forum.grrrr8.net/showthread.php?t=12411

The fact that its limits are so low is enough to put it on this list.

I wish they made the SC Cortex more like the Cobb Accessport. You can use it out of the box but you can also get it tweaked to your car on a dyno. That would make it a much better piece then what it is currently.

[GeorgeInNePa]

The email tune and cable that went with it. I should have gone for the dyno tune from the beginning. It was fine before I started changing a lot of things.

[vert]

I would have to say the 55W 6000K hids. I wish I would have installed the 35W, 55W is just too damn bright.

[Devilish34]

The email tune and cable that went with it. I should have gone for the dyno tune from the beginning. It was fine before I started changing a lot of things.

I would agree :(

[G8GT721]

i also regret email tune with the cable it worked great, but i have a well know tuner 30mins from my house.

Magnaflow cat-back, it drones a bit and wasn't loud enough, I cut off the mufflers and installed a set of Pypes Violaters

Atari bezel, because i had them reprogrammed so the bezel will not work

[Ktlplxm]

Oh I forgot another one (I pulled it off so haven't thought about it in a while), BMR Strut tower brace. Completely useless suspension-wise, but it did make a good armrest when changing plugs

[grandmacpubah]

I would agree :(

Even though I will go with a dyno tune after the cam, I think I"m still happy with the email tune. I've changed and added a bunch of stuff along the way that has been free with my current tune. So I would rather have the email tune that can be tweaked along the way than have to pay for a full dyno tune everytime.

[Torqued]

My yank that flashes at 4600 and left me SOL.


What was it supposed to stall at? Did you contact Yank? Definately would be a costly PITA to fix even if they offered to fix the converter.

[AUGAH]

Great thread. Not really a mod, but Crazy Paul's V6 Radiator cover for me. Great product and customer service but had to cut it to fit the Vararam, don't like the look of the unfinished edges where it has been trimmed.

[Tempest2000]

The deer at 70mph mod LOL smelt like deer jerky for a month LOL

When I first bought the corsa w/o the shorty headers I was REALLY disappointed at WOT yeah it sounded good outside, but I like to hear it inside too.

After the headers, holy hell best thing I've ever done :) I call it lojack for my car when the wife is driving I hear her driving it hard up to 7 miles away LMAO.

I'm not going to say I regret my cam, but I'm going to a smaller cam when I go FI. I want it 100% to drive like stock so I'm going with a cheater cam.

Car sounds mean with the cam in it now, but the 2 to 1 downshift sometimes surges a little which I'm ok with. The wife however forgets and doesn't keep a firm foot on the brake and it will surge forward sometimes. Not under normal driving just after a fun run usually.

[G8GT594]

What was it supposed to stall at? Did you contact Yank? Definately would be a costly PITA to fix even if they offered to fix the converter.

3600 and yes i contacted Yank. I honestly will never give them a dime of my money again. I'm getting rid of the garbage soon when i do my gear swap. And no they won't fix there mistake at all.

[Ktlplxm]

3600 and yes i contacted Yank. I honestly will never give them a dime of my money again. I'm getting rid of the garbage soon when i do my gear swap. And no they won't fix there mistake at all.

This is the type of feedback we need on certain companies. Do you have any of the correspondence in emails?

[Mike P]

3600 and yes i contacted Yank. I honestly will never give them a dime of my money again. I'm getting rid of the garbage soon when i do my gear swap. And no they won't fix there mistake at all.


Paul:

What kind of torque converter & stall RPM are you going to be going with?

Curious.......



...

[Andy@Livernois]

Paul:

What kind of torque converter & stall RPM are you going to be going with?

Curious.......



...

I would pray (you better listen to me paul, look what happened last time :P ) his stock converter restalled about 3-400 rpm...

[Andy@Livernois]

This is the type of feedback we need on certain companies. Do you have any of the correspondence in emails?

TMK it was all on the phone. I know I spoke with them, Dan spoke with them. If it didn't totally suck, it would be funny. I learned from my phone calls that stall speed is a tunable parameter, as we somehow tuned it wrong so it stalled too high. :hang:

[G8GT594]

This is the type of feedback we need on certain companies. Do you have any of the correspondence in emails?

I wish i had documentation and email to show then maybe i could have taken this problem even further. Everything was discussed over the phone. I would have to say i spent over 4 hours on the phone in ONE day and this was going on for over 2 weeks trying to meet halfway and get this issue resolved but they would not budge. I know people have had good experience with them. This was all about customer service and me getting a defective product from the start. After seeing the way they conducted business my recommendation is to stay away.

[r33pwrd]

I wish i had documentation and email to show then maybe i could have taken this problem even further. Everything was discussed over the phone. I would have to say i spent over 4 hours on the phone in ONE day and this was going on for over 2 weeks trying to meet halfway and get this issue resolved but they would not budge. I know people have had good experience with them. This was all about customer service and me getting a defective product from the start. After seeing the way they conducted business my recommendation is to stay away.

You should do a write up on your experience so it can be shared on other Forums as well.

[G8GT594]

I would pray (you better listen to me paul, look what happened last time :P ) his stock converter restalled about 3-400 rpm...

LOL! Shoulda, woulda, coulda, but didn't lol.

Mike, Going to restall the stock converter...

Andy were is my 3.70! I got some cash to burn!!

[Andy@Livernois]

LOL! Shoulda, woulda, coulda, but didn't lol.

Mike, Going to restall the stock converter...

Andy were is my 3.70! I got some cash to burn!!

you said you would call me when ready (it's not like you don't have my cell number ya know). I have been looking for some (just in case) to see if any popped up for availability by themselves. it just looks like its time to plunk it down and order one...

[Mike P]

LOL! Shoulda, woulda, coulda, but didn't lol.

Mike, Going to restall the stock converter...
Andy were is my 3.70! I got some cash to burn!!



Sounds good, I hope that works out........




...

[Mike P]

What's up Andy? :) You're just about to 1,000 posts.....



...

[G8GT594]

you said you would call me when ready (it's not like you don't have my cell number ya know). I have been looking for some (just in case) to see if any popped up for availability by themselves. it just looks like its time to plunk it down and order one...

Yup sounds like it. Ill give you a call late this week or early next week and get the ball rolling :woohoo:

[Andy@Livernois]

hmm, didn't even notice. I've been slammed at work so i haven't been posting as much, but finally got caught up a little.

[G8GT594]

hmm, didn't even notice. I've been slammed at work so i haven't been posting as much, but finally got caught up a little.

What you talkin about boy? :boxing: Work is never supposed to be busy! :hang:

[pokey]

Did you do both the calipers and brackets red? If so redo the brackets in black and it will look much better.

Actually only painted the calipers, brackets are still silver. Maybe I just need to upgrade to the Brembo's? I think anything less I will not be 100% happy! :)

[mjf232]

NEP OTR - Brand new engine later and now a none #'s matching Ignition Orange G8.

But hey, I got the full warranty from 0 again and even though my odometer reads 20k + miles, the engine now only has 3k.

[dukeofpg]

NEP OTR - Brand new engine later and now a none #'s matching Ignition Orange G8.

But hey, I got the full warranty from 0 again and even though my odometer reads 20k + miles, the engine now only has 3k.
Who paid for the new engine?

[MGM GT]

My yank that flashes at 4600 and left me SOL.

Does the converter physically work fine otherwise?

Its normal for a converter to flash higher then the rated brake stall. You went with a 3600 converter so should have expected it to flash about 4,000 especially with your power in a heavier vehicle. Yours is a bit high but not totally outta the ordinary, my 3600 FTI flashes a good bit over 4,000.

If you look on the other LS forums its common for a Yank 3200 to flash to 4,000 and a 3,600 to flash over 4,000. So that's probably why Yank is saying its normal.

[kalveerbhullar]

Regretted Mod: Bug Deflector

Reason: It's Gay

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha ha.

that made me laugh for some reason.

[SpeedRacerX]

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha ha.

that made me laugh for some reason.

Welcome over here to this Forum!!! It's about time.

[kalveerbhullar]

i regret my wheels and tires....love them but i rather go back to stocks...i just miss my stock 19s in flat black...
and if anyone makes a good offer on the im willing to part from them... :D

[jellis]

Yeah Owen did my tune. IMO it did nothing but raise shift points and that type of stuff. We looked on HPTuners after and all the timing tables were stock and the car didnt pull any harder. All i got out of it was a dyno number.
Mozilla/5.0 440x240 Samsung SCH-U940 NetFront/3.4

sorry to hear that, i specifically asked them NOT to adjust my shifting as i researched and many blown trannies as a result of people moving there stock set stock tranny shift points up to 65-6800 where the motor is still making power. other than that, i was lucky i guess by using Owen.

i went there tonight to dyno the G8 "as stock" and Gary cut me a pretty deal on the dyno pulls.

306/324 stock with no mods at all..

[Andy@Livernois]

Does the converter physically work fine otherwise?

Its normal for a converter to flash higher then the rated brake stall. You went with a 3600 converter so should have expected it to flash about 4,000 especially with your power in a heavier vehicle. Yours is a bit high but not totally outta the ordinary, my 3600 FTI flashes a good bit over 4,000.

If you look on the other LS forums its common for a Yank 3200 to flash to 4,000 and a 3,600 to flash over 4,000. So that's probably why Yank is saying its normal.

It does indeed work fine. I think Paul's problem was there were 3 yank 3600's installed in our shop within 3 weeks time on 68's with almost identical mods. 2 of them stalled at 3600-3800, pauls is 1k high. I just tease him because I told him 20+ times don't go higher than 3200, but recommended a 2800 (since every converter company builds them too loose I knew a 2800 would most likely be a 3k). In fact, I believe the minute he ordered it I got a text that said "I know you are gonna tell me I am stupid, but..."

From my stand point I feel for him because Yank wont even adjust the converter.

[MGM GT]

From my stand point I feel for him because Yank wont even adjust the converter.

That part is odd because they say you get 1 free re-stall within 12 months.

[Andy@Livernois]

That part is odd because they say you get 1 free re-stall within 12 months.

I think that is the biggest reason Paul was upset (It's been about 6 months so I can't 100% remember all the small details). You would have to verify with him, but I know in all the times we have talked about his converter Paul mentioned that he was told that if he wanted it changed he would have to pay because Yank test's every converter before it leaves.

[Livernois Motorsports]

What you talkin about boy? :boxing: Work is never supposed to be busy! :hang:

Hi Paul :banana: It's very busy, but that's a good thing!

-Rick

[m1tankr]

Great thread & keep the info coming. This just made my choice between Yank & Circle D much easier.

[Ktlplxm]

Does the converter physically work fine otherwise?

Its normal for a converter to flash higher then the rated brake stall. You went with a 3600 converter so should have expected it to flash about 4,000 especially with your power in a heavier vehicle. Yours is a bit high but not totally outta the ordinary, my 3600 FTI flashes a good bit over 4,000.

If you look on the other LS forums its common for a Yank 3200 to flash to 4,000 and a 3,600 to flash over 4,000. So that's probably why Yank is saying its normal.

That is way high for a foot stall/flash difference. If its normal for their converters that just means their converters are poorly made. Thats why I only get converters from Protorque. They are dead on the money every time we've used them. Where they say it will stall, it will stall. We even installed one in a vehicle other than the one it was designed for. We called them with the build nummber, told them the new weight, gearing, and power of the car and they predicted the foot stall and flash stall within 100rpm. Two years, two trans, and 2 seasons at the strip, and the converter still works beautifully.


I think that is the biggest reason Paul was upset (It's been about 6 months so I can't 100% remember all the small details). You would have to verify with him, but I know in all the times we have talked about his converter Paul mentioned that he was told that if he wanted it changed he would have to pay because Yank test's every converter before it leaves.

What do they do to test it? Test fit it to the box? They obviously didnt test the stall. I especially like the "stall speed is the tuners responsibility" line. thats like saying valvespring coil bind is the tuners fault. why hasn't someone called the local FTC representative about the refusal to retune the flash?

[MGM GT]

That is way high for a foot stall/flash difference. If its normal for their converters that just means their converters are poorly made. Thats why I only get converters from Protorque. They are dead on the money every time we've used them. Where they say it will stall, it will stall. We even installed one in a vehicle other than the one it was designed for. We called them with the build nummber, told them the new weight, gearing, and power of the car and they predicted the foot stall and flash stall within 100rpm. Two years, two trans, and 2 seasons at the strip, and the converter still works beautifully.



What do they do to test it? Test fit it to the box? They obviously didnt test the stall. I especially like the "stall speed is the tuners responsibility" line. thats like saying valvespring coil bind is the tuners fault. why hasn't someone called the local FTC representative about the refusal to retune the flash?

Pretty good prices on those but I didn't see any for the 6L80... did they make one custom for you?

[G8GT594]

That is way high for a foot stall/flash difference. If its normal for their converters that just means their converters are poorly made. Thats why I only get converters from Protorque. They are dead on the money every time we've used them. Where they say it will stall, it will stall. We even installed one in a vehicle other than the one it was designed for. We called them with the build nummber, told them the new weight, gearing, and power of the car and they predicted the foot stall and flash stall within 100rpm. Two years, two trans, and 2 seasons at the strip, and the converter still works beautifully.



What do they do to test it? Test fit it to the box? They obviously didnt test the stall. I especially like the "stall speed is the tuners responsibility" line. thats like saying valvespring coil bind is the tuners fault. why hasn't someone called the local FTC representative about the refusal to retune the flash?

I asked there about there testing procedure after the fact because they kept stating "we tested it before it left and it was locking and unlocking perfectly" Totally ignoring the fact that the fucking thing was could push on up to 4800RPM. Then they played the blame game saying it was who installed it, they broke something, car is running to hot, and a bunch of other bullshit just so they could get there hands free. In the end i got fucked. I would have to pay for restall, shipping too and from, and not to mention removal and reinstalling it. And then the wait time, god only knows how long that it would take to for them to fix it and send it back. Let me just put it this way. I was basically told to go fuck myself and that it was either my fault or the installers fault and they would NOT stand behind there product.

[Ktlplxm]

Pretty good prices on those but I didn't see any for the 6L80... did they make one custom for you?

Not for my G8. I hate stall converters as a general rule :)
Knowing that, the fact I speak so highly of them should tell you something. They can custom make them for the 6L80's they just don't have a huge demand for them at the moment so they didn't bother revamping the website to include them.
they are the ONLY torque converter company I will ever trust again.

[G8GT594]

It does indeed work fine. I think Paul's problem was there were 3 yank 3600's installed in our shop within 3 weeks time on 68's with almost identical mods. 2 of them stalled at 3600-3800, pauls is 1k high. I just tease him because I told him 20+ times don't go higher than 3200, but recommended a 2800 (since every converter company builds them too loose I knew a 2800 would most likely be a 3k). In fact, I believe the minute he ordered it I got a text that said "I know you are gonna tell me I am stupid, but..."

From my stand point I feel for him because Yank wont even adjust the converter.

Yes i did send you that text LOL! And look what happened i got totally screwed. Well now is a time for change so now ill restall the stock or get a new one and have at 2800 or 3000 to make it a 3200. It's funny because i had 3 other people tell me no don't order it and i did. Live and learn i guess.


Hi Paul :banana: It's very busy, but that's a good thing!

-Rick

Rick whats up man! How is the balt handling it this winter?

[MGM GT]

Not for my G8. I hate stall converters as a general rule :)
Knowing that, the fact I speak so highly of them should tell you something. They can custom make them for the 6L80's they just don't have a huge demand for them at the moment so they didn't bother revamping the website to include them.
they are the ONLY torque converter company I will ever trust again.

Ain't that the truth! I damn near sold the car due to the trans... I love driving a manual.

So your putting all your power through a stock converter?

[Mike P]

I asked there about there testing procedure after the fact because they kept stating "we tested it before it left and it was locking and unlocking perfectly" Totally ignoring the fact that the fucking thing was could push on up to 4800RPM. Then they played the blame game saying it was who installed it, they broke something, car is running to hot, and a bunch of other bullshit just so they could get there hands free. In the end i got fucked. I would have to pay for restall, shipping too and from, and not to mention removal and reinstalling it. And then the wait time, god only knows how long that it would take to for them to fix it and send it back. Let me just put it this way. I was basically told to go fuck myself and that it was either my fault or the installers fault and they would NOT stand behind there product.



That sucks..... So much for Yank's customer service......



...

[MGM GT]

That sucks..... So much for Yank's customer service......

...

Sounds like it slips as much as their converters....

[Mike P]

Not for my G8. I hate stall converters as a general rule :)
Knowing that, the fact I speak so highly of them should tell you something. They can custom make them for the 6L80's they just don't have a huge demand for them at the moment so they didn't bother revamping the website to include them.
they are the ONLY torque converter company I will ever trust again.


+1

In hindsight, I wish I would have kept the stock stall, and just went with a milder cam.......

Oh well......



...

[Ktlplxm]

That sucks..... So much for Yank's customer service......



...

No, no. I'm sure their customer service is great... if they ever find where they put it.. probably under the wobbly leg on the table in the lounge..:oops:

[Mike P]

Sounds like it slips as much as their converters....


Yep.....



...

[Torqued]

3600 and yes i contacted Yank. I honestly will never give them a dime of my money again. I'm getting rid of the garbage soon when i do my gear swap. And no they won't fix there mistake at all.

Thanks for the feedback. I didn't mean to center the discussion around the converters or Yank. The comment surprised me because Yank had a good reputation...at least 10 years back. Change of ownership?

Doesn't a new converter from any manufacturer need to be broke-in for several hundred miles so the surfaces don't glaze over? If that's the case, wouldn't there be issues if it were installed, tuned, dynoed, tuned, etc...?

Back to to the orginal topic, the only mod I regret was the hood vent mod. The steam that rose out of the openings made my car look like it was on fire after driving through rain. Fortunately it was free and reversible.

[G8GTSBM]

The only mod I regret is, I should have got the GXP mod instead of the GT. I would have came out ahead of the game. O well.

[Ktlplxm]

The only mod I regret is, I should have got the GXP mod instead of the GT. I would have came out ahead of the game. O well.

Think so? The only advantage I've seen in a GXP is the brake package. The .2 liters doesn't do jack. Once you've done a H&C package they are pretty much the same. The biggest benefits they have stock are gear, bigger camshaft, and premium fuel tune. Put the exact same mods on both and you have almost exactly the same numbers

[r33pwrd]

Think so? The only advantage I've seen in a GXP is the brake package. The .2 liters doesn't do jack. Once you've done a H&C package they are pretty much the same. The biggest benefits they have stock are gear, bigger camshaft, and premium fuel tune. Put the exact same mods on both and you have almost exactly the same numbers

-nicer wheels
-Manual tranny option
-nicer bumpers
-Ect.

[Ktlplxm]

-nicer wheels
-Manual tranny option
-nicer bumpers
-Ect.

wheels = ugly (too much like australian wheels
manual trans = would sell it in heartbeat
nicer bumpers = well they are cheaper to replace and easier to get
ECT= Engine coolant temp?

[Mighty Horse]

Once you've done a H&C package they are pretty much the same.

Ok, I know this is probably a dumb question. But, what is a H&C package? Headers and Cam?

[Panzer Leader]

Only thing I regret is that it is taking so long. Hope there are vendors at the National Meet that will do on-site installation.

[Ktlplxm]

Ok, I know this is probably a dumb question. But, what is a H&C package? Headers and Cam?

Heads and cam.

[GeorgeInNePa]

Think so? The only advantage I've seen in a GXP is the brake package. The .2 liters doesn't do jack. Once you've done a H&C package they are pretty much the same. The biggest benefits they have stock are gear, bigger camshaft, and premium fuel tune. Put the exact same mods on both and you have almost exactly the same numbers

This.

All things being equal, it seems to be a 10-15hp difference between the two.

Since it's a 12ci diff, that makes sense.

[JPEGXP]

FE3 suspension on the GXP as well........... just saying

[GeorgeInNePa]

I just want to say that I love my Yank converter and I had no problems with it.

BUT


If I had to decide on a converter company now, based on the opinions in this thread, I would probably pass on Yank and go with another brand. That's a pretty powerful story and not a smart way to get "word of mouth" advertising.

I went with Yank based on the recommendation of VMS and so far I've been happy with my choice. If I needed another converter, based on my experience, I would choose Yank again.

My converter is "tight".

[fiveoh]

My converter is "tight".

Thats what she said.

[GeorgeInNePa]

lol

Had to see that coming...

[G8GT721]

wheels = ugly (too much like australian wheels
manual trans = would sell it in heartbeat
nicer bumpers = well they are cheaper to replace and easier to get
ECT= Engine coolant temp?

lol

i like the new sig line

[-Ray-]

Oh yeah. I have a mod I regret. It's the ZR1 replica's I bought for drag radials.

[mjf232]

Who paid for the new engine?

My Insurance Company (12k total w/rental car).....Thank God!!!!

[2StepsAhead]

Oh yeah. I have a mod I regret. It's the ZR1 replica's I bought for drag radials.
How come you didn't like them?

[99-LS1-SS]

This.

All things being equal, it seems to be a 10-15hp difference between the two.

Since it's a 12ci diff, that makes sense.

Hey, don't be diss'n my 12 inches.....


In all honesty, if you were/are going to track race your car then the GXP is the better option. The brakes are much better as well as the gearing and manual transmission. If you just chillin or driving it daily then the GT is fine.

I got if for the manual transmission and the rarity of the GXP. Plus, I really like the LS3 motor.

[Mike P]

I can agree with this. I do like my Yank 3200, I think with a good tune I will like it even better.

I guess it's been so long that I've been without my stock torque converter, I've probably forgotten what it feels like. For city driving and driving around parking lots is where I really kind miss the factory torque converter.

But I do like the "race car" type driving feel that the Yank has. I think once I get my new dyno/street tune, I'll be a happier camper..... :)



...





I just want to say that I love my Yank converter and I had no problems with it.

BUT


If I had to decide on a converter company now, based on the opinions in this thread, I would probably pass on Yank and go with another brand. That's a pretty powerful story and not a smart way to get "word of mouth" advertising.

I went with Yank based on the recommendation of VMS and so far I've been happy with my choice. If I needed another converter, based on my experience, I would choose Yank again.

My converter is "tight".

[jaxredg8]

What mods do I regret? All the ones I havent done yet!! YET!

[G8GT594]

I just want to say that I love my Yank converter and I had no problems with it.

BUT


If I had to decide on a converter company now, based on the opinions in this thread, I would probably pass on Yank and go with another brand. That's a pretty powerful story and not a smart way to get "word of mouth" advertising.

I went with Yank based on the recommendation of VMS and so far I've been happy with my choice. If I needed another converter, based on my experience, I would choose Yank again.

My converter is "tight".

I do agree. I know that Yank can make an excellent product as we seen by your car and other members. However, i have never seen a company not stand behind there product like Yank has. I was in no way trying to bash them . If i wanted to i would have posted a huge review when i first had it installed but i had figured my problem was a fluke. What is unacceptable and unexcused was the way they treated a customer, and leaving them out there to try with a busted product. Even a simple, ship it back and we will take care of it would have been better than we tested it, worked fine in the factory, now its your fault and/or installers fault and thats why it stalls so high so sorry we don't want anything to do with it.

[Mike P]

I do agree. I know that Yank can make an excellent product as we seen by your car and other members. However, i have never seen a company not stand behind there product like Yank has. I was in no way trying to bash them . If i wanted to i would have posted a huge review when i first had it installed but i had figured my problem was a fluke. What is unacceptable and unexcused was the way they treated a customer, and leaving them out there to try with a busted product. Even a simple, ship it back and we will take care of it would have been better than we tested it, worked fine in the factory, now its your fault and/or installers fault and thats why it stalls so high so sorry we don't want anything to do with it.


I totally agree......



...

[majesticix]

My Insurance Company (12k total w/rental car).....Thank God!!!!

I would have to agree, the NE OTR intake is my only regret, though things have been fine with the cover now on. That and trying to take off the intake cover which resulted in a snapped head bolt which had to be drilled. Had that and a blown engine in a span of 3 weeks...a shitty start to my summer for sure. I could have used that money to put some headers on dammit!

[edfiero]

I had a Yank on my 96 Impala SS. That thing was awesome. No issues with it at all behind my 383 Stroker.

[99-LS1-SS]

I'm another Yank fan too. I've had 2 and loved both of them.

[G8GT594]

Like i said, you win some, you lose some. I'm eating my loss right now so whatever.

[Andy@Livernois]

Don't worry Paul, they lost us as a shop due to that whole fiasco... Precision Industries will continue to get our business for how well they worked with us on Roy's converter. THAT was true customer service!

[Mike P]

Don't worry Paul, they lost us as a shop due to that whole fiasco... Precision Industries will continue to get our business for how well they worked with us on Roy's converter. THAT was true customer service!


Andy:

When I come in to get tuned by you guys you'll have to tell me what you think of my Yank 3200 stall. (i.e. - If it's good, stalls where it's supposed to... blah blah blah....)

I'll be calling you in the near future..... :woohoo:



...

[edmanet]

Yes I said that. This isn't a rant against any tuner or company out there. It's just my opinion. I can see locking mail order tunes so guys can't pass them around like candy. A dyno tune is for a specific setup on a car. While that tune may work on another car its not going to run at its best.

If your tune has issues you have a problem:

-- you can't even look at your tune and say look there's the issue....I'll contact my tuner

-- if you're at the track and have issues....you have to stop racing because even though you might have tuning software there's nothing you can do

-- you have to wait for your tuner to get back to you

-- if your tuner is far away from you all your gonna back are tunes to test because they can't see, hear, etc... what your car is doing. Even if you send them logs its still just a guess on their part

-- you have to spend more $$$ to get someone to unlock your tune if you aren't happy or just want to try something else



While that $500 tune might be the tuners....its your $30,000 car. And now your car is a hostage unless you're willing to pay more to get it unlocked.
It just doesn't make sense for dyno tunes. The good tuners will still make money and the bad will disappear.

I'd be willing to pay extra money not to have my tune locked if the tuner I was using has a policy to lock tunes.

Instead of locking you out of your own tune, couldn't the tunes be made
vin# specific ??

I personally don't know anything about tuning but I do know I don't
like a locked tune.

[GRRRR8]

yes i said that. This isn't a rant against any tuner or company out there. It's just my opinion. I can see locking mail order tunes so guys can't pass them around like candy. A dyno tune is for a specific setup on a car. While that tune may work on another car its not going to run at its best.

If your tune has issues you have a problem:

-- you can't even look at your tune and say look there's the issue....i'll contact my tuner

-- if you're at the track and have issues....you have to stop racing because even though you might have tuning software there's nothing you can do

-- you have to wait for your tuner to get back to you

-- if your tuner is far away from you all your gonna back are tunes to test because they can't see, hear, etc... What your car is doing. Even if you send them logs its still just a guess on their part

-- you have to spend more $$$ to get someone to unlock your tune if you aren't happy or just want to try something else



while that $500 tune might be the tuners....its your $30,000 car. And now your car is a hostage unless you're willing to pay more to get it unlocked.
It just doesn't make sense for dyno tunes. The good tuners will still make money and the bad will disappear.

I'd be willing to pay extra money not to have my tune locked if the tuner i was using has a policy to lock tunes.

Instead of locking you out of your own tune, couldn't the tunes be made
vin# specific ??

I personally don't know anything about tuning but i do know i don't
like a locked tune.

^Exactly!!^

[Devilish34]

What sucks is it's going to cost you 200-300 just to get a new ecm w/a stock tune.
I was really hoping to hear that you could use my stock ecm.

[Ktlplxm]

I hate to hear you're having that trouble at all. It is definitely a necessary evil with tuning. Will they not unlock and remove their tune for you at least? It isn't like it takes much effory

[MGM GT]

Yes I said that. This isn't a rant against any tuner or company out there. It's just my opinion. I can see locking mail order tunes so guys can't pass them around like candy. A dyno tune is for a specific setup on a car. While that tune may work on another car its not going to run at its best.

If your tune has issues you have a problem:

-- you can't even look at your tune and say look there's the issue....I'll contact my tuner

-- if you're at the track and have issues....you have to stop racing because even though you might have tuning software there's nothing you can do

-- you have to wait for your tuner to get back to you

-- if your tuner is far away from you all your gonna back are tunes to test because they can't see, hear, etc... what your car is doing. Even if you send them logs its still just a guess on their part

-- you have to spend more $$$ to get someone to unlock your tune if you aren't happy or just want to try something else

While that $500 tune might be the tuners....its your $30,000 car. And now your car is a hostage unless you're willing to pay more to get it unlocked.
It just doesn't make sense for dyno tunes. The good tuners will still make money and the bad will disappear.

I'd be willing to pay extra money not to have my tune locked if the tuner I was using has a policy to lock tunes.

Instead of locking you out of your own tune, couldn't the tunes be made
vin# specific ??

I personally don't know anything about tuning but I do know I don't
like a locked tune.

I concur and bit my tongue until now... locked tunes are a pain in the ass. Unfortunately I did not realize I was receiving a locked tune until my car was already in the shop. I didn't think many people locked dyno tunes since the LS2EDIT days so I didn't even think to ask. I found out during discussions with a third party and immediately brought it up to the tuner but they refused any other options.

Had my car run correctly to begin with then it wouldn't be such an immediate problem. There are a few major problems that need to be addressed!

My main concerns are:

* Significant idle surge! My car will cut off if it idles for more then a couple minutes.

* My car will self drive itself in M1 and M2 which is scary, it just takes off! You have to be on the brakes hard for it not to!

* Car will self rev to 4k RPM in neutral and just sit there without falling.

* Occasionally hard to start back up after it cuts off.

I didn't expect this out of a well known tuner that spent two days tuning the car.

I regret my locked tune!


Honestly I'm not satisfied over the whole ordeal. I still haven't received all my stock parts back and they forgot to install all the parts I provided. This is annoying in itself but even more so when I think about it as my car cuts off at a long light or I have to deal with the other issues that arise.

I know nobody is perfect, to err is human. Its all about how you handle problems when they arise. To date nothing has been done to rectify my problems.

[Ktlplxm]

That's the type of shop you need to bring to everyone's attention in a thread in the tuners section.as well. Include all Of the facts, and let future customers beware. Then the shop has a chance for rebuttal

[Mike P]

I concur and bit my tongue until now... locked tunes are a pain in the ass. Unfortunately I did not realize I was receiving a locked tune until my car was already in the shop. I didn't think many people locked dyno tunes since the LS2EDIT days so I didn't even think to ask. I found out during discussions with a third party and immediately brought it up to the tuner but they refused any other options.

Had my car run correctly to begin with then it wouldn't be such an immediate problem. There are a few major problems that need to be addressed!

My main concerns are:

* Significant idle surge! My car will cut off if it idles for more then a couple minutes.

* My car will self drive itself in M1 and M2 which is scary, it just takes off! You have to be on the brakes hard for it not to!

* Car will self rev to 4k RPM in neutral and just sit there without falling.

* Occasionally hard to start back up after it cuts off.

I didn't expect this out of a well known tuner that spent two days tuning the car.

I regret my locked tune!


Honestly I'm not satisfied over the whole ordeal. I still haven't received all my stock parts back and they forgot to install all the parts I provided. This is annoying in itself but even more so when I think about it as my car cuts off at a long light or I have to deal with the other issues that arise.

I know nobody is perfect, to err is human. Its all about how you handle problems when they arise. To date nothing has been done to rectify my problems.


MGM GT:

Who is your car currently tuned by?



...

[MGM GT]

MGM GT:

Who is your car currently tuned by?



...

Dan Millen of Livernois Motorsports

[Mike P]

Dan Millen of Livernois Motorsports


Are you hoping that they make it right? Or are you going to go to Fran @ RPM?



...

[MGM GT]

Are you hoping that they make it right? Or are you going to go to Fran @ RPM?


...


I would hope they would make it right considering it has their name engraved in it. They built and tuned it!

Having another shop fix your mistakes looks even worse.

[GRRRR8]

I concur and bit my tongue until now... locked tunes are a pain in the ass. Unfortunately I did not realize I was receiving a locked tune until my car was already in the shop. I didn't think many people locked dyno tunes since the LS2EDIT days so I didn't even think to ask. I found out during discussions with a third party and immediately brought it up to the tuner but they refused any other options.

Had my car run correctly to begin with then it wouldn't be such an immediate problem. There are a few major problems that need to be addressed!

My main concerns are:

* Significant idle surge! My car will cut off if it idles for more then a couple minutes.

* My car will self drive itself in M1 and M2 which is scary, it just takes off! You have to be on the brakes hard for it not to!

* Car will self rev to 4k RPM in neutral and just sit there without falling.

* Occasionally hard to start back up after it cuts off.

I didn't expect this out of a well known tuner that spent two days tuning the car.

I regret my locked tune!


Honestly I'm not satisfied over the whole ordeal. I still haven't received all my stock parts back and they forgot to install all the parts I provided. This is annoying in itself but even more so when I think about it as my car cuts off at a long light or I have to deal with the other issues that arise.

I know nobody is perfect, to err is human. Its all about how you handle problems when they arise. To date nothing has been done to rectify my problems.

I am no expert, but your minimum air rate and cranking air rate tables are off. It sounds like they are way off.

[norm8332]

Same Locked tune regret. Same company. Was locked out, no more mods. This after I thought that the tune was unlocked (for very good reason). Had to buy a new ECM and HP Tuners tune for $550 total.

Wasn't handled well.:(

On a brighter note there is a way to break free, but it costs.

[edmanet]

That's the type of shop you need to bring to everyone's attention in a thread in the tuners section.as well. Include all Of the facts, and let future customers beware. Then the shop has a chance for rebuttal

We need to see the larger version of "the neighbors wife"

[wnt2gofst]

HMMM..what do i regret..

Well the dodge ram front end mod..

Car painted last thursday and friday...:woohoo:

[Devilish34]

We need to see the larger version of "the neighbors wife"



here (http://www.evilmilk.com/pictures/Neighbors_Wife.jpg) but I think it the daughter

[GeorgeInNePa]

My first tune was locked.

The tune in the car now isn't.

If I have to trust my tuner to not fuck something up, shouldn't he be able to trust me to not let anyone copy it?

[-Ray-]

here (http://www.evilmilk.com/pictures/Neighbors_Wife.jpg) but I think it the daughter

Come on now. Don't be making me go look. LOL

http://www.evilmilk.com/pictures/Neighbors_Wife.jpg

[Ktlplxm]

We need to see the larger version of "the neighbors wife"



here (http://www.evilmilk.com/pictures/Neighbors_Wife.jpg) but I think it the daughter


Come on now. Don't be making me go look. LOL

http://www.evilmilk.com/pictures/Neighbors_Wife.jpg

Sorry about that link disappearing. For some reason Photobucket deleted four pictures for "nudity" including that one. Funny I don't see nudity in it

but back to the mods regretted, I've had a good relationship with Livernois on everything I've done, but tuning is something I haven't had from them (its a little far to drive, and mail order tuning isn't worth the postage paid from anyone)

[Mike P]

Sorry about that link disappearing. For some reason Photobucket deleted four pictures for "nudity" including that one. Funny I don't see nudity in it

but back to the mods regretted, I've had a good relationship with Livernois on everything I've done, but tuning is something I haven't had from them (its a little far to drive, and mail order tuning isn't worth the postage paid from anyone)


Ktlplxm:

Who does your tuning then?

(As you can tell I'm in the market for a new ECM/TCM dyno-street tune....)



...

[Ktlplxm]

Ktlplxm:

Who does your tuning then?

(As you can tell I'm in the market for a new ECM/TCM dyno-street tune....



...

All of my tuning is done by Jeff At Carolina Auto Masters. There are a few guys out there that complain about him (usually after they go to another dyno and put down higher numbers w a "new tune, yet they don't seem to run any faster), but I can't complain. Mine makes more power, has better manners, and better economy than all but a handful of guys out there. I trust him implicitly with my vehicles. Having said that, I still would only use him if you can get the vehicle too him; too many variables in a mail order tune

[Mike P]

All of my tuning is done by Jeff At Carolina Auto Masters. There are a few guys out there that complain about him (usually after they go to another dyno and put down higher numbers w a "new tune, yet they don't seem to run any faster), but I can't complain. Mine makes more power, has better manners, and better economy than all but a handful of guys out there. I trust him implicitly with my vehicles. Having said that, I still would only use him if you can get the vehicle too him; too many variables in a mail order tune


I hear you. I also would rather have better 1/4 mile numbers, than dyno numbers... yep.

I gotta just get my ECM/TCM wiped clean & just start with a new dyno/street tune....

--> Thanks for the input.....



...

[Ktlplxm]

Performance is preferable to paper

[Tempest2000]

Livernois uses ls2edit I believe and its setup in the software by ls2edit not livernois. I spoke to the software company directly about it when I was considering learning to tune the trans myself. I believe Vector uses the same software as well.

The software manufacturer said that the only way to "unlock" the tune was to return it to the original tune.

Don't hold me to this verbatim as its been months since I discussed this with the ls2edit guys.

Livernois/Dan was really good about fixing any issues I had with the tune after it relearned. He was able to resolve the issues from my description and log files. he made two adjustments and got both issues resolved without me having to make the trip back to Michigan.

I've had nothing but good experiences with Livernois... I plan on them installing the maggie and tuning it for me.

[Devilish34]

Livernois uses ls2edit I believe and its setup in the software by ls2edit not livernois. I spoke to the software company directly about it when I was considering learning to tune the trans myself. I believe Vector uses the same software as well.

The software manufacturer said that the only way to "unlock" the tune was to return it to the original tune.

Don't hold me to this verbatim as its been months since I discussed this with the ls2edit guys.

Livernois/Dan was really good about fixing any issues I had with the tune after it relearned. He was able to resolve the issues from my description and log files. he made two adjustments and got both issues resolved without me having to make the trip back to Michigan.

I've had nothing but good experiences with Livernois... I plan on them installing the maggie and tuning it for me.

If this is the same it looks like the tuner has an option to buy a locked or unlocked version


We are currently shipping both the unlimited-E/TCM version and the ECM/TCM-locked version of LS2-edit for 2005 - 2010 cars and trucks. Upon receipt of fully paid orders, we ship within 2 business days.
http://carputing.tripod.com/LS2main.htm


Also from Corvette forms
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-scan-and-tune/1221329-ls2-edit-locking-and-unlocking-official-word.html

[edmanet]

Livernois uses ls2edit I believe and its setup in the software by ls2edit not livernois. I spoke to the software company directly about it when I was considering learning to tune the trans myself. I believe Vector uses the same software as well.

The software manufacturer said that the only way to "unlock" the tune was to return it to the original tune.

Don't hold me to this verbatim as its been months since I discussed this with the ls2edit guys.

Livernois/Dan was really good about fixing any issues I had with the tune after it relearned. He was able to resolve the issues from my description and log files. he made two adjustments and got both issues resolved without me having to make the trip back to Michigan.

I've had nothing but good experiences with Livernois... I plan on them installing the maggie and tuning it for me.

Then if a customer wants his tuned unlocked the tuner should oblige the customer if said customer doesn't like his tune or wants to try something different.

And how long should said customer put up tune issues ???? 3 months, 6 months, even 9 months ???? How many test tunes should a customer try out 10...12....to get his tune correct ???

I never said anything bad about Livernois, I just said I don't like locked tunes. They make your car a hostage.

[Tempest2000]

Where does it say they have an unlocked version? unlimited means number of cars you can tune not that it is unlocked.

Yes I agree that if you choose to use another company for tunes they should assist you to at least get back to a base tune so that the other company can help you out. Should they give you the tuning parameters they used i.e. trans tune etc? No I don't think they should the other company could easily take those and use them as their own.

Its no different than in the IT world which I work in. This issue comes up with Developers writing code all the time. You own the finished product unless contracts say otherwise. You aren't entitled to the code specifically.

Again I have NO idea what the issues were or who we are even talking about. There are always two sides to a story.

I'm not sure why I'm being addressed with others' issues with Livernois as I have NO association with them other than as a customer. I just stated I had a good experience with them.

[Devilish34]

Where does it say they have an unlocked version? unlimited means number of cars you can tune not that it is unlocked.

Yes I agree that if you choose to use another company for tunes they should assist you to at least get back to a base tune so that the other company can help you out. Should they give you the tuning parameters they used i.e. trans tune etc? No I don't think they should the other company could easily take those and use them as their own.

Its no different than in the IT world which I work in. This issue comes up with Developers writing code all the time. You own the finished product unless contracts say otherwise. You aren't entitled to the code specifically.

Again I have NO idea what the issues were or who we are even talking about. There are always two sides to a story.

I'm not sure why I'm being addressed with others' issues with Livernois as I have NO association with them other than as a customer. I just stated I had a good experience with them.

Sorry miss read must be too tired lol

[norm8332]

I had a good experience with them too. The only issue at all for me was the locked tune. But at this point I'm OK.

Now the people that still have the locked tunes should be able to do an ECM swap at the very least. Livernois did this for me, putting my stock tune and VIN on a G8 ECM and after I got my car tuned, I sent the locked one back. I give them credit for that. But it ended up costing me when the tune was not supposed to be locked in the first place.

[Tempest2000]

I went from Vector to Livernois with 0 issues, but both use the same software...

[edmanet]

I had a good experience with them too. The only issue at all for me was the locked tune. But at this point I'm OK.

Now the people that still have the locked tunes should be able to do an ECM swap at the very least. Livernois did this for me, putting my stock tune and VIN on a G8 ECM and after I got my car tuned, I sent the locked one back. I give them credit for that. But it ended up costing me when the tune was not supposed to be locked in the first place.

I second that.........

[edmanet]

Where does it say they have an unlocked version? unlimited means number of cars you can tune not that it is unlocked.

Yes I agree that if you choose to use another company for tunes they should assist you to at least get back to a base tune so that the other company can help you out. Should they give you the tuning parameters they used i.e. trans tune etc? No I don't think they should the other company could easily take those and use them as their own.

Its no different than in the IT world which I work in. This issue comes up with Developers writing code all the time. You own the finished product unless contracts say otherwise. You aren't entitled to the code specifically.

Again I have NO idea what the issues were or who we are even talking about. There are always two sides to a story.

I'm not sure why I'm being addressed with others' issues with Livernois as I have NO association with them other than as a customer. I just stated I had a good experience with them.


No one is addressing you. The post was about locked tunes in general....You stated that you had minor issues with a tune and they were fixed. People responded to your post.

When I asked to have my tune unlocked to try something else it was like I committed a mortal sin and received no help. Hell if I switch tunes and don't like the new one I'll switch back. All WE want is to be able to make a choice.

[Tempest2000]

np

[edmanet]

np

:)

[Kirk@VectorMotorsports]

Just for the record, we do not lock any tune performed on the dyno. It seems there may be confusion in this area.

Head/Cam cars many times need tweaking. If the customer is not local to you they must be able to take their car somewhere else to get it fixed. Period.

You do not have to return a car to stock to unlock a tune using LS2 edit.

Also, we have NEVER locked ANY TCM calibration.

The only reason we lock our FlashXpress and PowerFlash system is to keep people frome copying it and installing it into multiple vehicles.

[G8GT594]

Just for the record, we do not lock any tune performed on the dyno. It seems there may be confusion in this area.

Head/Cam cars many times need tweaking. If the customer is not local to you they must be able to take their car somewhere else to get it fixed. Period.

You do not have to return a car to stock to unlock a tune using LS2 edit.

Also, we have NEVER locked ANY TCM calibration.

The only reason we lock our FlashXpress and PowerFlash system is to keep people frome copying it and installing it into multiple vehicles.

Really???

Why did i have to buy a new ECM when i had someone else tune my car? I know for a fact that mine was locked...

[Kirk@VectorMotorsports]

Really???

Why did i have to buy a new ECM when i had someone else tune my car? I know for a fact that mine was locked...

We dyno tuned your car?

Why would you buy a new ECM anyway? We would alway unlock it for free for you.

[Tempest2000]

I had a flash tune from vector before livernois and Livernois had no issues to my knowledge. I believe Andy said they would have to get a hold of vector to tune my car. Which I'm assuming means vector unlocked it or sent them an unlocked file.

I did have a flash tune though which makes sense based on what kirk said.

[G8GT594]

We dyno tuned your car?

Why would you buy a new ECM anyway? We would alway unlock it for free for you.

I believe after the header install... unless there was a canned tune put on it.

[Kirk@VectorMotorsports]

I believe after the header install... unless there was a canned tune put on it.

Generally we do dyno tune after installing headers. Do you remember getting a dyno sheet? We are upgrading the dyno computer so I can not look it up.

If so the tune should not have been locked. If for some reason it appeared locked I would have checked it and unlocked it for you if necessary.

[G8GT594]

Generally we do dyno tune after installing headers. Do you remember getting a dyno sheet? We are upgrading the dyno computer so I can not look it up.

If so the tune should not have been locked. If for some reason it appeared locked I would have checked it and unlocked it for you if necessary.

Yes i have the the dyno sheets for before the header install and after the install.

[-Ray-]

Before this gets too far into locked tune discussion, lets be reminded this is about mods we regret, not just tunes. If need be we'll move that to another thread.

[Patrick G]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?

[MGM GT]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?

Yes, I should have gone with turbo's. :headbang:

[99-LS1-SS]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?

I almost regretted it with the stock GXP mufflers because it was way too damn loud. After I put a set of GT mufflers on the car I was much happier.

[Voice of Reason]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?

Overall I'm very happy with my Kooks LTs. Great fit/finish. It does make the engine sound noisier due to a slight tinny ticking noticeable when I remote start the car. But I don't hear the tinny sound at all while driving, which is not the case with cheaper headers I've had in the past on other cars.

[Mike P]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?


Not me, I love my Kooks headers. I'm sure American Racing would have been great as well. The key is to have them ceramic coated, they still look relatively new in the engine bay.

It gave more engine & exhaust noise that I wanted, but not to much, and is not obnoxious in the least. I have high flow cats & the stock GT axle back and it sounds pretty good, if you are looking for "semi-stealth" zero drone.

Now if you want an aggressive sound Paul aka G8GT594 has the Kooks axle back (can't remember if it is Gen 1 or 2) and from the outside on start up, it sounds bad ass! I've never rode in his car so I can't speak about the drone if any.....



...

[fiveoh]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?

I love mine, just a few things I dont like about them.

1. A lot noiser then the stock exhaust from the engine compartment(i.e. the ticking/tinking noise). It's especially noticeable with the windows down. It's not loud or annoying, I just think it sounds like crap, especially cruising at a low rpm/part throttle.

2. When the afm kicks on and im at a low speed(sometimes it stays on around 40mph when im barely on the gas) it causes a vibration. I did not have this before the headers/xpipe so I can only assume its some kind of exhaust vibration caused by the AFM. As I said it only does it with the AFM on at a low rpm(13-1400). I just speed up or downshift to get it to go away. (Has anyone else had this problem with headers? Do I need to get them tightened or anything or is that just the way they are?)

2 realtively minor issues and i do not REGRET the headers but those are the only downsides now that I've had them a while. Oh and my tires dont like the extra hp in this cold weather. :)

[wreckwriter]

I have the full Kooks 1 7/8 system. Yes its loud, yes it drones, yes I love it. Its a muscle car, you expect these things.

[Ktlplxm]

I love the performance of my Kooks, but I still despise the tinking noise. Mine are uncoated (since IMO and experience coated stainless is pointless), but they still look great in the engine bay. Until Kooks goes out of business I won't look for another headers brand.

[Devilish34]

I love the performance of my Kooks, but I still despise the tinking noise. Mine are uncoated (since IMO and experience coated stainless is pointless), but they still look great in the engine bay. Until Kooks goes out of business I won't look for another headers brand.

+1 and I really don't hear any tink(or maybe it just doesn't bother me) and there is zero drone with the stock muffs

[MGM GT]

+1 and I really don't hear any tink(or maybe it just doesn't bother me) and there is zero drone with the stock muffs

Does yours not sound like a sewing machine at part throttle with the stock mufflers?

[mi04se1]

Right now, my only regret is not having enough money for a maggie, headers and cam.

[fiveoh]

Does yours not sound like a sewing machine at part throttle with the stock mufflers?

lol sewing machine. Mine does thats what I was talking about in my previous post.

[MGM GT]

lol sewing machine. Mine does thats what I was talking about in my previous post.

Gotcha, yeah mine is either god awful loud if I use aftermarket mufflers or whisper quiet and extremely lame sounding with the stockers on.

[jakesg8]

I have no regrets about any of the mods on the fourm.They are all very nice people. even Brandon

[rez0nance]

i have no regrets about any of the mods on the fourm.they are all very nice people. Even brandon

lol!

[Ktlplxm]

I have no regrets about any of the mods on the fourm.They are all very nice people. even Brandon

Of all the ones to call out, Brandon? lol thats rich

[GeorgeInNePa]

Of all the ones to call out, Brandon? lol thats rich

that's because you people talk funny...

;)


:nah:

[Devilish34]

that's because you people tawk funny...

;)


:nah:

Fixed

Actually Aden sounds like a Yank

[99-LS1-SS]

that's because you people talk funny...

;)


:nah:

I don't sound like a hick in my head....but, when I hear my voice playing back on a recording of some sort I think, "Damn I sound like a hick". lol Oh well, as long as it doesn't bother me I don't care if it bothers anyone else! :nah:

[edmanet]

I don't sound like a hick in my head....but, when I hear my voice playing back on a recording of some sort I think, "Damn I sound like a hick". lol Oh well, as long as it doesn't bother me I don't care if it bothers anyone else! :nah:

I wished I lived in the land of cotton........

[99-LS1-SS]

Yeah...old times there are not forgotten.....

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[jakesg8]

Sorry I sent this thread spinning out of control.

I was just trying to be funny LOL





Look away look away

[Devilish34]

Does yours not sound like a sewing machine at part throttle with the stock mufflers?

Sewing machine lol hmm maybe but I'm rarely ever at part throttle.
I'll see if I can take her for a slow ride this weekend.

@ or about 24sec into it is part throttle
aNw1XPGbrQI

[GRRRR8]

Anybody regret buying headers? Too much noise? Unrefined sounds? Check engine lights?

No regrets even when the engine was stock.

You do hear all the DOD "tink" in them.

Check engine light is as simple as turning off rear O2s.

[Mike P]

Yeah...old times there are not forgotten.....

Sorry, I couldn't resist.


Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land...... :D



Hee hee :)



...

[RapidG8GXP]

:nud:

[JoeSyko]

The only mod I'm regretting (and it's a partial regret) would be the Vararam. Performance wise I have no complaints and dealing with the company has always been top notch. My issue is with the install. I don't like how loose the radiator is and mine seems to be even looser than other G8's with the Vararam.

[GeorgeInNePa]

The only mod I'm regretting (and it's a partial regret) would be the Vararam. Performance wise I have no complaints and dealing with the company has always been top notch. My issue is with the install. I don't like how loose the radiator is and mine seems to be even looser than other G8's with the Vararam.

I didn't like that either, but it's very simple to fix.

I took an old socket rack, 6 inches long, and bent it. It was like a 3x3 L, then I trimmed an inch off one leg. Drill two holes, and Bob's yer Uncle!

I took the bolt out of the radiator and the condenser and mounted it there. The other end goes to the plastic tab on the rad support.

[edmanet]

I didn't like that either, but it's very simple to fix.

I took an old socket rack, 6 inches long, and bent it. It was like a 3x3 L, then I trimmed an inch off one leg. Drill two holes, and Bob's yer Uncle!

I took the bolt out of the radiator and the condenser and mounted it there. The other end goes to the plastic tab on the rad support.

I saw George's mod. It looks nice and is very sturdy.

[GRRRR8]

The Jetttstream hoses also make it very firm as well.

[edmanet]

The Jetttstream hoses also make it very firm as well.

I still need to get mine on the car. I've had them for a good 4 months.

[GeorgeInNePa]

I saw George's mod. It looks nice and is very sturdy.

That was just a 10 minute fix.

I need to do it with something that looks nicer.

[MGM GT]

Sewing machine lol hmm maybe but I'm rarely ever at part throttle.
I'll see if I can take her for a slow ride this weekend.

@ or about 24sec into it is part throttle
aNw1XPGbrQI

Needs more cowbell...

[GeorgeInNePa]

Needs more cowbell...http://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii437/aclc02thunderbird/Fun/sign-Cowbell130124930_std.jpg (http://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii437/aclc02thunderbird/Fun/sign-Cowbell130124930_std.jpg)

[GT-610]

I dont understand all of the complaints about the loose radiator...Mine is tight? doesnt budge at all....

[MGM GT]

That was just a 10 minute fix.

I need to do it with something that looks nicer.

A $350 intake shouldn't need a fix... which is amongst the reason so many people have it on this list.



Speaking of regret... my Livernois tune is driving me nuts this week. Nothing like letting your wife drive it only for her to come back and say that it cut off twice and it idles at 60MPH and almost rear ended someone.

I sent a message to Livernois last week, yet nothing has been done. Same problems I've had since I picked my car up on Dec 19th.

Nothing like supporting a vendor and getting nothing in return. I'd rather have punched myself in the dick.

[G8GT721]

I'd rather have punched myself in the dick.

lmao

[norm8332]

A $350 intake shouldn't need a fix... which is amongst the reason so many people have it on this list.



Speaking of regret... my Livernois tune is driving me nuts this week. Nothing like letting your wife drive it only for her to come back and say that it cut off twice and it idles at 60MPH and almost rear ended someone.

I sent a message to Livernois last week, yet nothing has been done. Same problems I've had since I picked my car up on Dec 19th.

Nothing like supporting a vendor and getting nothing in return. I'd rather have punched myself in the dick.


The tune is locked because it's so good someone might want to copy it.:shf:

[Ktlplxm]

I dont understand all of the complaints about the loose radiator...Mine is tight? doesnt budge at all....
Maybe yours is still in a bind from the electrical connector on the passenger side being attached... just an idea. the fitment was my initial reason for complaint.


The tune is locked because it's so good someone might want to copy it.:shf:

Someone near Buffalo find Norm and kick him in the nuts please :uhm:

[norm8332]

I was being sarcastic. Sorry about your issues MGM.

[edmanet]

A $350 intake shouldn't need a fix... which is amongst the reason so many people have it on this list.



Speaking of regret... my Livernois tune is driving me nuts this week. Nothing like letting your wife drive it only for her to come back and say that it cut off twice and it idles at 60MPH and almost rear ended someone.

I sent a message to Livernois last week, yet nothing has been done. Same problems I've had since I picked my car up on Dec 19th.

Nothing like supporting a vendor and getting nothing in return. I'd rather have punched myself in the dick.

How about if we just bitch slap one another.....It might not hurt as much.
LOL

[GRRRR8]

I find the Vararam issues funny. I have installed 8 or 9 of them, all with the non-reinforced scoop and none have more then a 1/4 play(which is what the radiator moves from the factory), all of them including mine the scoop is fine and only mine has different radiator hoses.

Things that make you go Hmmmmmm.

[Ktlplxm]

How about if we just bitch slap one another.....It might not hurt as much.
LOL

If we're all getting slapped, can I choose to get slapped by Polo? He's kinda small and I think he may need a step ladder to get in a good hit, and while we're choosing, if we raffle off who gets to slap John, we can fund the National G8 meet this fall :nutkick:

[GRRRR8]

If we raffle off who gets to slap John, we can fund the National G8 meet this fall :nutkick:

I have my hand full of baby powder for a full blown PIMP SLAP! LMAO!!!

[Ktlplxm]

I have my hand full of baby powder for a full blown PIMP SLAP! LMAO!!!

Charlie, where's that hammer you and I were discussing yesterday?

[polo]

If we're all getting slapped, can I choose to get slapped by Polo? He's kinda small and I think he may need a step ladder to get in a good hit, and while we're choosing, if we raffle off who gets to slap John, we can fund the National G8 meet this fall :nutkick:

Hey now!

I bet everyone else does look short when you're 7'6". I'll still knock you the fuck out. :boxing:

[Ktlplxm]

I have my hand full of baby powder for a full blown PIMP SLAP! LMAO!!!


Hey now!

I bet everyone else does look short when you're 7'6". I'll still knock you the fuck out. :boxing:

Don't forget your step ladder:jerkoff: jk

[polo]

Don't forget your step ladder:jerkoff: jk

I'll just take out your knees first. Fighting on a step ladder doesn't sound like a good idea.

[GRRRR8]

Charlie, where's that hammer you and I were discussing yesterday?

National back order. :rofl:

[Devilish34]

Nothing like supporting a vendor and getting nothing in return. I'd rather have punched myself in the dick.

Tell us how you really feel

[Devilish34]

Needs more cowbell...

:uhm:

Oh and I heard the sewing machine today but only with the windows down going real slow

[Ktlplxm]

I'll just take out your knees first. Fighting on a step ladder doesn't sound like a good idea.

Thats not fair!! You still have to look up!!

I think we need an insult specific thread, this is too much fun

[Devilish34]

If we're all getting slapped, can I choose to get slapped by Polo? He's kinda small and I think he may need a step ladder to get in a good hit, and while we're choosing, if we raffle off who gets to slap John, we can fund the National G8 meet this fall :nutkick:
Thats fucked up


I have my hand full of baby lotion for a full blown PIMP SLAP! LMAO!!!

Don't slip and knock yourself out


Charlie, where's that hammer you and I were discussing yesterday?



National back order. :rofl:

Must be a nice hammer

[edmanet]

If we're all getting slapped, can I choose to get slapped by Polo? He's kinda small and I think he may need a step ladder to get in a good hit, and while we're choosing, if we raffle off who gets to slap John, we can fund the National G8 meet this fall :nutkick:

:rofl: :shiner: :rofl: :shiner: :rofl:

[MGM GT]

How about if we just bitch slap one another.....It might not hurt as much.
LOL

haha yeah it might. I feel even worse for you, I've only had four weeks of misery... you had a year!



:uhm:

Oh and I heard the sewing machine today but only with the windows down going real slow

I knew you would find it eventually! Nothing like a 6L Singer.

[polo]

Ya'll are just jealous, cause you know if you weighed 150 like me you'd be running 2 tenths faster.

[Ktlplxm]

Thats fucked up

you know you laughed!! Well, we all did at least


:rofl: :shiner: :rofl: :shiner: :rofl:
see someone thought it was hilarious


Ya'll are just jealous, cause you know if you weighed 150 like me you'd be running 2 tenths faster.

but I couldn't drive to the event, I'd be in eighth grade!! Well i was last time I was 150lbs.
With the good food your around everydayI don't see how you stay 150. Those Pitas are HUGE

[polo]

With the good food your around everydayI don't see how you stay 150. Those Pitas are HUGE

I eat like a freakin' PIG! The only way I gain weight is if I work out. I got up to 170 once (from 140), then stopped lifting and lost nearly all the weight I had gained.

No one in my family is thin, so I don't know where I got it from. It'll probably catch up to me one day.

[Ktlplxm]

I eat like a freakin' PIG! The only way I gain weight is if I work out. I got up to 170 once (from 140), then stopped lifting and lost nearly all the weight I had gained.

No one in my family is thin, so I don't know where I got it from. It'll probably catch up to me one day.

In most situations where there is one way skinnier than the rest the gene responsible came from the Mailman

[Devilish34]

haha yeah it might. I feel even worse for you, I've only had four weeks of misery... you had a year!




I knew you would find it eventually! Nothing like a 6L Singer.

I don't hear it in cabin but I heard it as I was rolling through the strip mall lol

[Devilish34]

you know you laughed!! Well, we all did at least




maybe

[polo]

In most situations where there is one way skinnier than the rest the gene responsible came from the Mailman

I was illegitimate anyways, so it wouldn't surprise me.

Oh for those who have never seen Aden or me, here's a pic:

http://www.anorak.co.uk/wp-content/gallery/worlds-tallest-man-worlds-shortest-man/8210340.jpg

[Ktlplxm]

I was illegitimate anyways, so it wouldn't surprise me.

Oh for those who have never seen Aden or me, here's a pic:

http://www.anorak.co.uk/wp-content/gallery/worlds-tallest-man-worlds-shortest-man/8210340.jpg

That photo doesn't do you justice, you have way more hair than that

[99-LS1-SS]

Lmao!

[polo]

In most situations where there is one way skinnier than the rest the gene responsible came from the Mailman

I know you're definitely your mother's son. Here's one with me and your mom:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_CvXEhdXFheY/SNEUKfwK2KI/AAAAAAAADRI/A5x4tfUvNWE/s400/Svetlana+Pankratova+tall+woman+craps+on+the+worlds +shortest+man.jpg

[Mike P]

OMG, this thread is funny! I just read the last 3 pages...... Nice! lol :D



...

[edmanet]

Ya'll are just jealous, cause you know if you weighed 150 like me you'd be running 2 tenths faster.

I only weigh 160 fully clothed. :thumbsup:

[edmanet]

haha yeah it might. I feel even worse for you, I've only had four weeks of misery... you had a year!




I knew you would find it eventually! Nothing like a 6L Singer.

Don't exaggerate its only been 11 months !!!

[MGM GT]

Don't exaggerate its only been 11 months !!!

I bet it feels like two years...

[Devilish34]

i only weigh 160 fully clothed. :thumbsup:

tmi

[RapidG8GXP]

^^^lol^^^

[Ktlplxm]

yeah I always felt sorry for dad, Thats a BIG BITCH

[EcoBrick Bob]

This is my biggest regret. Water swirls backward!!!!!!http://i334.photobucket.com/albums/m406/RobMoser/IMG_5166.jpg

:threadjacked:

[G8GT721]

yeah I always felt sorry for dad, Thats a BIG BITCH

lmao, NSFW

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