Snow Tires!

[Seattle09GT]

Well I did it, I got a set of snow tires...

...they happen to be attached to a 1998 Pontiac Transport.

When I saw the van on Tuesday I was happy to notice that it really was described. Black exterior (with a ton of silver flake in it, very nice color) with a gray interior. Short wheel base van with remote entry, alarm, power driver seat, power mirrors, power windows, power door locks, trip computer, front and rear interior map lights, automatic headlights, front and side airbags, AM/FM Stereo cassette with rear seat audio system and equalizer, fog lamps, rear wiper/washer, rear defroster, single zone air conditioning, privacy glass, roof rack, alloy wheels, and six passenger seating.

The body is in great shape for an 11 year old two owner van.

http://forum.grrrr8.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3522&d=1253846310

And I couldn't believe how clean the interior was.

http://forum.grrrr8.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3519&stc=1&d=1253846392

Not only clean, but the more I looked around the more I was shocked to find that after 140K miles and two owners still had all the original floor mats, still had all the original cargo nets, and they weren't stretched out to crap, the lower cubby still had the removable tray, the dashboard still had the sticky pad in the top tray, and everything was outright - clean.

http://forum.grrrr8.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3518&stc=1&d=1253846392

At the time I looked at the van the only issues I could find was the ABS idiot light was on, the brake pedal was soft, the passenger side front fog light wasn't operating, and the interior door trim on the driver door has a broken top clip (or two). So I had the van inspected this morning by my mechanic. When I drove it my reverse commute this morning I noticed a fair amount of noise coming from the rear, and guessed that a rear wheel bearing was failing and that would probably cause the ABS light to be on.

But the thing that I was so shocked with is that everything - works. On Tuesday when it was 87 the air conditioning blew cold. This morning the defroster did away with the morning dew, the rear wiper did it's job, the cruise control worked, the stereo operated, no buttons worn out. I mean don't get me wrong, it squeaks and groans like an 11 year old Pontiac, but this is shockingly tight.

So my mechanic went through it. Here is the sum total of what it needs:

1) Rear wheel bearing and antilock brake speed sensor assembly (oh snap, damn I'm good).

2) Power steering, power brakes, and transmission fluid flushed

3) Recommends new plug wires as they are the OEM plug wires that came with the van, 11 years old with 140K miles on them.

4) While they were inspecting the van I had them adjust the rear brakes, as they were so badly out of adjustment they wouldn't even engage when you hit the brake pedal. That firmed up the brake pedal big time and greatly improved stopping power (d'uh).

They told me the engine is very strong (compression check) across all six cylinders, tranny is in excellent condition (sans the near black fluid in it), tie rod ends, struts, CV boots and joints, steering all in excellent condition. New serpentine belt, new water pump, new coolant, engine looks brand new. Front brakes have 50% to 60% on them, rear brakes have 60% to 70%.

So basically I need to drop about $500 between a hardcore tune up and the bearing assembly to have a perfect van. WOOT!

But then it gets better. I go to close the deal and what do I find in the glove box? The freakin' owner's manual, how well cared for can you get?

http://forum.grrrr8.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3520&stc=1&d=1253846392

Then I notice a thick white envelope under the owner's manual. Are you ready. ALL THE SERVICE RECEIPTS!!! Holy ass crackers, this thing is a cream puff. Then they hand me both keys, with both key fobs for the alarm/door locks, and they work, and one of the fobs still has the metal tag on it for cutting new keys if lost, or for dropping the keys in the mail to have them sent back to me via GM. How on earth in 11 years this never got lost is beyond me.

So my winter beater car cost me $1935.50 with the title/license transfer fees, $186.20 for the sales tax, and $129.90 for the inspection this morning. I figure $500 into it in the next few weeks and then if I get two to three fall/winters out of it, plus yeoman duty to Home Depot and the grocery store, not to mention not pounding commuting miles into the G8, it totally pays off for itself. I suspect if I can keep up its condition, and it doesn't have some major failure, I can at the end of the day get what I paid for it when I grow tired of the Pontiac Beater, err, van, err Transport, err G8 snow tires!

http://forum.grrrr8.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3521&stc=1&d=1253846392

[Monty]

Needs rims. :)

[majesticix]

jesus christ...I paid nearly $1400 just for a set of winter rims and tires (and TPMS). That is a great find!

[Seattle09GT]

jesus christ...I paid nearly $1400 just for a set of winter rims and tires (and TPMS). That is a great find!

And that is exactly why after I did the math, I decided the best route was to find a car from $1.5K to $3K to do the winter duty in. If I found something at the lower end I would have kept it one winter and sold it back off, probably for what I paid for it.

If you do a search on Craig's List and you're willing to drive an unappealing vehicle during the winter months, or to do crap duty like going to the grocery store, you can find low mile Ford Tempos all over the place (at least out here) for under $1,000 - and many of them are little old lady cars. I ALMOST bought one for $800 but it had too many question marks and I wasn't going to shell out $100 to $200 on a vehicle inspection to answer the questions on an $800 car.

I drive around 20K miles a year, so if I cut those miles in half, in five years the G8 has 50K mles and those 50K miles will be pure enjoyment miles, not sitting in bumper to bumper traffic in pouring rain or slush in the dark. That is the hidden benefit. At 20K miles a year, I'm shredding the value of my G8 faster (I say faster as a car is a depreciating asset no matter what), but at 8K to 10K miles a year it is slightly below average. That might mean an extra $1K in value each year. My OEM tires should last 3 to 4 years now, instead of barely two, that in itself is huge. No snow tires, no replacing the brakes probably in the entire time I own the G8, etc. etc. It is dirt cheap insurance.

On the subject of insurance my insurance rate went up $23 a month to add the second vehicle (I am over 40, live in the 'burbs, and haven't had a ticket in forever or an at fault accident in 8 years). That includes having comprehensive (the Transport has a MASSIVE windshield) coverage but no collision (it just isn't worth it) and liability coverage out the butt. I also got towing and road side assistance (lets face it, the car is old, and even with a perfect inspection could blow up tomorrow). I dropped rental coverage, no sense in having it now that I own two cars. If one or the other is disabled, drive the other car.

The other thing I would suggest if people are reading this and going, "wow, I should do that," is if you have a MP3 player, look for a beater with a tape player. Most 10 year old CD players are crap that don't operate well, but most 10 year old tape players were barely used. Get a $15 cassette adpater for the tape player (make sure it works) and you can listen to your MP3 player while driving all day long.

The rest is probably obvious, do a Car Fax, make sure you're not getting curb stoned, do a third party vehicle inspection from someone you trust, and be patient when looking. I spent about a month looking at cars and looked at a LOT of pieces of crap. People's ideas of "good condition" on Craig's List is way, WAY off the mark off of my idea of good condition. You'll probably look at a lot of crap before you find the "little old lady," car that was garaged and well cared for, just driven until she had a few low speed parking lot bumps and took her license away.

[Culedood47]

Cool. :)

I did something similar. I bought a 99 Jeep Cherokee for the snow for $1600. It runs like a top.

[GotMyG8V8]

You know I was really thinking about doing that. Now i'm thinking of it more and more and more. As much as I love driving the g8, i would love to keep it perfect as much as possible :)

[Seattle09GT]

Well I went through all those owner records. Turns out they are from the FIRST owner.

Here is what I learned:

1) Bought in Ithaca, New York.

2) Dropped its transmission at 6,000 miles and was completely replaced in Missouri

3) Lots of highway miles probably as there are service receipts and toll receipts from Florida, Missouri, Indiana, and Pennsylvania.

4) Synthetic oil, every 3K miles.

5) New struts at 60K miles

6) Tire rotations every other oil change.

7) Alignment every year.

8) Struts replaced again just before 90K miles

9) All bodily fluids flushed and replaced

10) $169 worth of body work done for some damage on the front fender and hood - boy that had to have been minor.

11) Dealer replaced an $85 "module" but to what, I don't know.

12) The second owner did not care for the van as well as the first owner, but regular oil changes were maintained. The bodily fluids are 20K too old, except for the coolant which was just changed out at 140K miles. Still, 20K past the change point isn't the end of the world (certainly better than never changed).

13) As far as I can tell my mechanic is right, the plugs and wires have never been replaced. That seems so incredibly odd given the rigid service intervals followed through its history.

=================================

Lesson learned. Regular, proper maintenance of a vehicle goes a very long way to keeping it in good running condition. I scored a major deal and we've named her Stella.

[edfiero]

Great find, and good way to keep the G8 out of the salt this winter.

[chipman283]

I have been doing the math myself and came to the conclusion that I might as well get a beater for 2-3k instead of driving my G8. I have been looking for a S-10 so I can get stuff from Lowes to home( didn't think about a van).

[majesticix]

if I had a larger garage or bigger driveway...I probably would have went that route. Just make sure to slap on some good tires on your beaters. Chances are they are running with some well spent all season tires.

[Seattle09GT]

if I had a larger garage or bigger driveway...I probably would have went that route. Just make sure to slap on some good tires on your beaters. Chances are they are running with some well spent all season tires.

Brand new rubber all the way round, good M&S rated all season tires from Les Schwab.

[Seattle09GT]

I have been doing the math myself and came to the conclusion that I might as well get a beater for 2-3k instead of driving my G8. I have been looking for a S-10 so I can get stuff from Lowes to home( didn't think about a van).

Great minds think alike. A S-10 pickup was high on my list. Was next to impossible to find one in this price range with 4WD for the snow that just wasn't absolutely beat to bejesus and back. I know what is desirable in one part of the country doesn't hold much value in another. I would think in parts of the country where the construction boom when ker-blam hard that pickup trucks would be softer. We've been hit hard here, but not as hard as other regions.

I ended up gravitating toward the Pontiac Montana SWB model because they are really inexpensive, they didn't hold their resale value for crap. Going through Edmunds, KBB, and Consumer Guide the price range on a '98 in good condition was $1.4K to $2.7K depending on options and mileage. A ton of car for the money.

Ford Escort wagons (DON'T GET AN AUTOMATIC - THEY SUCK!!!) are also a dime a dozen and great in the snow and good for yeoman duty (just tossing out another idea). It also appears that Saturns run forever, lots of them available out there, the SW2 wagon is nice, about the same size as the escort.

I did find a GMC Jimmy with 168K miles and 4WD in this price range. Everything worked but it was VERY tired out, squeaked, creaked, rattled, but engine and tranny were still very strong.

[majesticix]

Brand new rubber all the way round, good M&S rated all season tires from Les Schwab.

Sure just rub it in.... ;)

[Seattle09GT]

Sure just rub it in.... ;)

Well, then you'll really hate this - LOL.

My Pontiac Grand Prix has 225/60R16 tires, and I got tire chains for it as required here in Washington to cross the passes.

The Transport has positively small truck sized tires of 215/75R15 - according to the tag on the tire chains - they're compatible! WOOT! Saved me $85 on tire chains. I'm skiing baby!